Thomas Cook

[Britannia94]

Aslong as the airline is doing ok. Due to fly with them in new year to states, last thing I need is them going under.

 

[airforced]

Most recent news on Thos Cook says shares fall by 60% in last eight days https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46440932. Is this a sign of something to come?

 

[rollo]

Gloomy news one.

I don't think Thomas Cook are on the danger list but appear to be working at it with debts exceeding the company value not good although profits still cover repayments.
Other signs are not encouraging given they are about to be ejected from the FTSE250 which means fund managers of some tracker funds are forced to sell driving the share price down and they have also stopped dividend payments which will also have the same effect. Additionally winter bookings 3%down.
I don't really get them saying that the hot summer was a major problem as other airlines in similar markets notably Jet2 seemed to cope o.k.

P.S.
Forgot to add they have a €700 plus million bond debt on the horizon due in 2022.

 

[paully]

Gloomy news one.

I don't think Thomas Cook are on the danger list but appear to be working at it with debts exceeding the company value not good although profits still cover repayments.
Other signs are not encouraging given they are about to be ejected from the FTSE250 which means fund managers of some tracker funds are forced to sell driving the share price down and they have also stopped dividend payments which will also have the same effect. Additionally winter bookings 3%down.
I don't really get them saying that the hot summer was a major problem as other airlines in similar markets notably Jet2 seemed to cope o.k.

P.S.
Forgot to add they have a €700 plus million bond debt on the horizon due in 2022.

I agree, the hot summer is an excuse, not a reason. My opinion, for whats its worth, is that TC and Tui operated, for years, as the Cartel Twins, as I called them. They always seemed to work in tandem and never really trod on each others toes, at the same time both were as inefficent as the other. Then came Jet2..better business plan, better understanding of how to treat customers. Stronger management that actually knew what they were doing and an owner that set about frying the asses of the competition. That, not a hot summer is my take on an old fashioned, out of time, out of ideas holiday companies..Both of them

 

[Jerry]

Also people especially people holiday differently now. A lot more people book flights and hotels separately and online. Short breaks and city breaks are more popular not too mention that the world is more accessible and cheaper to get too. Whereas previous generations could only book with travel agents and afford a week or 2 in Spain the current generation can book a flight themselves anywhere in the world and most have the money to afford it and that's a challenge for companies like Thomas Cook.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Also people especially people holiday differently now. A lot more people book flights and hotels separately and online. Short breaks and city breaks are more popular not too mention that the world is more accessible and cheaper to get too. Whereas previous generations could only book with travel agents and afford a week or 2 in Spain the current generation can book a flight themselves anywhere in the world and most have the money to afford it and that's a challenge for companies like Thomas Cook.

The potential snag with booking separate flights and accommodation is that if the flight is cancelled you are unikely to get your accommodation money back unless your insurance covers it. Even when we've booked with a major tour operator (TUI in our case) and they've used easyJet as the carrier, we always have a concern that easyJet might cancel the flight, something that is not unknown with them. We'd get our money back for the entire booking from TUI because our contract is with them, not with easyJet, but we might not have a holiday.

When TUI or TCX use their own aircraft they invariably operate even if a day late because of bad weather or other operational constraint.

Travel agents can sometimes get a better deal than booking online direct with a carrier. With our recent trip to Australia we arranged a package via a long haul specialist that included Heathrow-Perth; four nights in a Perth hotel; Perth-Melbourne and Melbourne-Heathrow. It came out nearly 10% cheaper than if we'd just booked Heathrow-Melbourne return direct with the airline. We've found it cheaper to go via a travel agent each time we're gone to Australia in the past eight years.

 

[Jerry]

The potential snag with booking separate flights and accommodation is that if the flight is cancelled you are unikely to get your accommodation money back unless your insurance covers it. Even when we've booked with a major tour operator (TUI in our case) and they've used easyJet as the carrier, we always have a concern that easyJet might cancel the flight, something that is not unknown with them. We'd get our money back for the entire booking from TUI because our contract is with them, not with easyJet, but we might not have a holiday.

When TUI or TCX use their own aircraft they invariably operate even if a day late because of bad weather or other operational constraint.

Travel agents can sometimes get a better deal than booking online direct with a carrier. With our recent trip to Australia we arranged a package via a long haul specialist that included Heathrow-Perth; four nights in a Perth hotel; Perth-Melbourne and Melbourne-Heathrow. It came out nearly 10% cheaper than if we'd just booked Heathrow-Melbourne return direct with the airline. We've found it cheaper to go via a travel agent each time we're gone to Australia in the past eight years.

That is the downside but generally people seem to be willing to take the gamble. Me personally i've nearly always booked with the airline or through a site like Expedia. For my trip to the US for xmas it was via Kayak this time though that wasn't my preffered option.
I don't think i've ever booked using a travel agent or someone like Thomas Cook or TUI.

 

[Seasider]

It's an age thing. People of my generation - "permamently on holiday" - don't take easy to change ie book an IT package trough a travel agent. I recently went on a Jet2 holiday package to Portugal but after the new year going to Spain having booked my own flights and hotel.
I am obviously different. no questions please!

 

[TheLocalYokel]

It's an age thing. People of my generation - "permamently on holiday" - don't take easy to change ie book an IT package trough a travel agent. I recently went on a Jet2 holiday package to Portugal but after the new year going to Spain having booked my own flights and hotel.
I am obviously different. no questions please!

I'm a WW2 baby and have booked many flights and some holidays on the Internet. I've had Internet-accessible computers for over 20 years - in the days of AOL dial-up when only about 20% of the UK population (if that) was connected to the Net. So I have no hang-up about using the Net.

However, when it comes to slightly complex long-haul holidays I have found every time in the past decade that I can get a much better overall deal by using specialist travel agents than booking flights, hotels and even car hire separately online.

 

[Jerry]

Thomas Cook Airlines up for sale!
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-t...egic-review-of-airline-business-idUKKCN1PW0I9

 

[Foxlimayankee]

Misleading headline...
Thomas Cook said on Thursday it was willing to sell its airline business to raise cash.

Is willing to sell, not is selling.

 

[jfy1999]

Fewer Britons choosing EU countries for holidays, travel firm says

 

[lbaspotter]

Sky News are reporting this evening that Virgin Atlantic has entered the race to buy up Thomas Cook's UK Long Haul operations while Lufthansa Group wants to buy up buy its German Condor airlines short & long haul operations.

Condor
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...or-thomas-cooks-condor-ceo-idUSKCN1SD0OL?il=0
Virgin
https://news.sky.com/story/virgin-atlantic-flies-into-dogfight-over-thomas-cook-airline-11715547

Reading elsewhere that Indigo or Easyjet maybe interested in the UK Airlines short haul operations.

 

[Jerry]

£1.5 billion loss? Reported elsewhere it's £283 million.
https://news.sky.com/story/thomas-c...r-loss-as-brexit-hits-holiday-demand-11721113

 

[BlueManc]

Depends what number you run with. Journos likley to look for the biggest number.

Loss from Operations (EBIT) exc. goodwill impairment (282)
Loss before tax (1,456)

 

[Jerry]

Someone mentioned that the Mytravel purchase was included and that was £1.2 billion.
Problem is people will see that think TCX will go bust and stop booking. Also I wonder if the credit card companies may start holding back payments to protect themselves like they did with Flybe.

 

[Sherburnflyer92]

It's a very sad state of affairs. What really should of happened in hindsight is Thomas Cook, as it was then, let My Travel go to the wall and then pick up the fleet, staff/crew, slots and routes.TC had the fleet expertise anyway as MYT ran more or less the same fleets, A330, A321, A320 and B757/76. Unfortunately greed got the better of them and as such they are now paying the price after merging with MYT and absorbing all it's debts.

I can only hope the a solution is found to this high street brand and quick. It's about time the industry started putting pressure on our useless MP's for a solution to Brexit; or to at least start producing information relating to travelling within the EU post UK leaving. That is what is driving a lot of uncertainty.

 

[Rob c DSA]

Scaremongering stories starting in the media is not good news for the company. Thomas Cook are another company with major problems that aren't going to go away lets hope they can pull through however its more tough times ahead for them.

 

[paully]

It's a very sad state of affairs. What really should of happened in hindsight is Thomas Cook, as it was then, let My Travel go to the wall and then pick up the fleet, staff/crew, slots and routes.TC had the fleet expertise anyway as MYT ran more or less the same fleets, A330, A321, A320 and B757/76. Unfortunately greed got the better of them and as such they are now paying the price after merging with MYT and absorbing all it's debts.

I can only hope the a solution is found to this high street brand and quick. It's about time the industry started putting pressure on our useless MP's for a solution to Brexit; or to at least start producing information relating to travelling within the EU post UK leaving. That is what is driving a lot of uncertainty.

Brexit is just an excuse, as is warm summers and late Easters ..Their market share is on the slide in Scandinavia and Germany no less, as well..Its the massive debts they have, that has brought them to this point..happening as a result of crap management over many years and an ageing fleet that no one in their right minds is going to pay over the odds for. Jet2 showed them how to do it...TC didnt even know how to play catch up

 

[IanFarquharson]

Just out of interest Thomas Cook capacity in S20

MAN = 2,335,210 seats and 4th biggest operator
LGW = 1,469,466 seats and 7th biggest operator
BHX = 708,716 seats and 5th biggest operator

These negative press comments will make people shy away from booking with them