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scottrhino

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May 27, 2015
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It is catch 22 but we’ve gone from 14 day quarantine to air bridges and 1m social distancing which most ignorant people will ignore. Quite a change and one which certainly makes me nervous about a 2nd spike
 

Jerry

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It is catch 22 but we’ve gone from 14 day quarantine to air bridges and 1m social distancing which most ignorant people will ignore. Quite a change and one which certainly makes me nervous about a 2nd spike
As someone who has worked through the lockdown I've been surprised in the last 2 weeks about the change in people especially with the 2 metre social distancing. They just don't care. Yesterday I had a guy stand next to me with his child no concern whatsoever to try and look at the menu at burger king rather than just wait. This was in England. It's a bit better in Wales but even there I think people are starting to become lack about it all.
I'd be surprised if there wasn't a 2nd wave and another lockdown.
 

fight2win

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Mar 10, 2018
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baildon
www.easydrive-yorkshire.co.uk
Sorry Donald Trump and wise should never be in the same sentence! :ROFLMAO:
I like many others, esp what I see across FB , Find trump a spot on leader! up until this virus the US had never had it better, fantastic economy, a strong leader who actually puts his country first, does a far better job than all them useless lot at the UN at dealing with lets say rogue or hard to deal with countries, what he says he does unlike most other leaders. some just cant face this truth esp the media who constantly try to put him down. Instead of everyone having a go at trump, at the present time action needs to be taken over CHINA, nothing is ever said of the place even though they have pretty much brought the planet to a grinding halt, bankrupted endless countries, in this country alone millions out of work and caused the deaths of hundreds of thousands if not more and rising due to whatever they have been upto there, but hey lets keep moaning about trump!:(
 

Jerry

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I like many others, esp what I see across FB , Find trump a spot on leader! u
The man is the worst President ever. He's an egotistical lunatic that has helped destabilise the world and damaged the reputation of the USA worldwide.
up until this virus the US had never had it better, fantastic economy, a
Tell that to the homeless or the people struggling to keep a roof over their heads or the ones who can't afford healthcare or the people being brutalized by the police every day.
But hey Facebook Groups thinks he's great so who am I to argue with people on Facebook Groups! Especially the fake Russian ones that think he's great!
 

fight2win

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Mar 10, 2018
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baildon
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The man is the worst President ever. He's an egotistical lunatic that has helped destabilise the world and damaged the reputation of the USA worldwide.

Tell that to the homeless or the people struggling to keep a roof over their heads or the ones who can't afford healthcare or the people being brutalized by the police every day.
But hey Facebook Groups Groups thinks he's great so who am I to argue with people on Facebook Groups Groups! Especially the fake Russian ones that think he's great!
"the people being brutalized by the police every day." you mean mr George Floyd who was a known criminal, every crime under the sun **** inaccurate information edited out**** and the chap who got shot in the drive thru who at first was pissed at the wheel of a car,fell asleep then stole the police mans taser and fired it at him, umm! Obviously no one should die in the hands of the police but Just to clear things up, 5 times more whites die in both the US and UK in the hands of the police.
 
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Sherburnflyer92

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Obviously no one should die in the hands of the police but Just to clear things up, 5 times more whites die in both the US and UK in the hands of the police.
Don't want to step in or get political but your comment about 5 times more whites is there any proof of this? Because there is tonnes of research which proves that members of black population are more likely to be arrested or die at the hands of a white police There is plenty of footage and reports out there of this happening. And it's also happening in the UK; police stopped 2 black people and wanted proof they lived at their address as they "looked suspicious" for looking at a police car because it wasn't your bog standard white/blue etc police car.
 

Aviador

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Jan 12, 2009
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HEAD OFFICE
I know this is a hugely challenging subject and to be honest I don't want to get involved with the political side of this but here is my view on the legal question regarding posting an allegation.

Although I would strongly recommend not making allegations, in this instance I am sure the UK Crown Prosecution would not be interested in an alleged crime in another country and almost certainly not by someone who is now deceased. As we are using the World Wide Web and therefore access to F4A is possible from the country where the alleged citizen is now deceased. Incidentally, our servers are also based in the US, so the data we hold is held on US servers.

As a reference, new allegations were made about Michael Jackson after he had died and the family were unable to stop the alleged reports after Michael Jackson had died. It is therefore highly unlikely any court would be interested in such allegation under these circumstances.

Purely as an advisory comment I would definitely not recommend making an accusation against somebody who is living and it is probably not in the interests of the forum in cases where the alleged is deceased either. It is probably worth mentioning at this point that you are responsible for your posts so it is worth remembering that during general discussions.

All said I am happy for the discussion to continue, but remember the rules of the forum are there not necessarily as irritating nuisance but they're also there to protect you.

If anybody wants to re-check the rules, they're available at the bottom of the page.
 

Severn

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Mar 24, 2012
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Obviously no one should die in the hands of the police but Just to clear things up, 5 times more whites die in both the US and UK in the hands of the police.
That is not true, and this sort of inaccurate information is being used to silence the real problem by suggesting that the situation is not as bad as people are making out. Let's get some facts straight.... more white people may die at the hands of police in the US and UK, but this is because there is a much larger white population than black. Of course certain media (or posts on Facebook Groups for example) will leave this vital information out.

Going to the facts, the below is taken from a US government study about the use of lethal force by law enforcement. It's taken from the website of the US National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health:

All fatalities (812) resulting from use of lethal force by on-duty Law Enforcement from 2009 to 2012 in 17 U.S. states were examined using National Violent Death Reporting System data.
Victims were majority white (52%) but disproportionately black (32%) with a fatality rate 2.8 times higher among blacks than whites. Most victims were reported to be armed (83%); however, black victims were more likely to be unarmed (14.8%) than white (9.4%) or Hispanic (5.8%) victims.


I like many others, esp what I see across FB , Find trump a spot on leader! up until this virus the US had never had it better, fantastic economy, a strong leader who actually puts his country first, does a far better job than all them useless lot at the UN at dealing with lets say rogue or hard to deal with countries, what he says he does unlike most other leaders.
I'm going to refrain from talking about Trump, but I will say that working for a US company, having US colleagues, travelling to the US multiple times per year, and having a fair idea of what goes on over there, I can assure you that the US is not such a rosy place as described on the Facebook Groups groups you follow. Most of what you say (and Trump for that matter) like the UN, rogue countries, China etc, is great to rally your supporters but doesn't affect everyday Americans. I'll let you revert back to Jerrys post above which gives a nice overview!
 

TheLocalYokel

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Jan 14, 2009
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Yes
Don't want to step in or get political but your comment about 5 times more whites is there any proof of this? Because there is tonnes of research which proves that members of black population are more likely to be arrested or die at the hands of a white police There is plenty of footage and reports out there of this happening. And it's also happening in the UK; police stopped 2 black people and wanted proof they lived at their address as they "looked suspicious" for looking at a police car because it wasn't your bog standard white/blue etc police car.
Here are the recent official England and Wales figures for deaths in police custody or deaths following contact by police published by the Independent Office for Police Conduct.


Two of the most prevalent types of death in police custody involve those who have been either arrested for being drunk (ie 'drunk and incapable') or detained under the Mental Health Act.

'Found drunks' are often 'out of it' and not infrequently are taken to the local hospital where a doctor will deem them to be drunk. Understandably hospitals don't want them so, because they cannot be 'let go' (police have a duty of care), they have to be taken to the local nick to be detained until they sleep it off and become able to look after themselves. They will be visited regularly and if the custody officer is in any doubt a police surgeon will be called for advice. On occasions some of these people will die, perhaps through choking on their own vomit.

As an aside, in the early 1960s Bristol had a reputation for being the most sober city in the country. The reason was that the local police had a policy of not arresting drunks (like hospitals they didn't want drunks cluttering up their premises). It all came to a head when one evening a drunk was placed behind a hoarding on one of the many post-war derelict sites and died there during the night.

Half a century ago the government of the day recognised that the system for dealing with drunks was broken and decided on dedicated detoxification centres around the country staffed by suitably trained personnel to which those arrested for being drunk could be taken. One was built but the cost prohibited any more. In recent years some areas have used mobile centres where those the worse for drink can recover attended by trained staff, typically in large city centres on weekend evenings.

Those detained under the Mental Health Act are taken to a 'place of safety' which includes a police station or police custody suite. For many, many years governments and professional bodies have accepted that such people should be taken to a place of safety that is staffed by qualified professional personnel but the practicalities of that have usually prevented it, whereas the police maintain a 24-hour presence with easily accessible stations. The police have been asking for many years to be rid of a task for which they are not trained and for which their facilities are unsuitable. I'm not sure how far a government review of mental health provisions that occurred a couple of years ago has affected the situation.

The idea that most deaths in UK police custody or police contact, whether of BAME people or anyone else, are the result of some form of assault by police officers is not borne out by the official statistics.

The notion that all UK police officers are racist and that all young black men are criminals is as far away from the truth as can be imagined. In a recent Spectator article a retired police commander wrote a piece on the extreme difficulties of policing a multi-racial society.

He wrote that the police are told by various factions of society, "That they’re too aggressive and too politically correct; too understanding and too intolerant. They’re required to reduce the level of violent crime on the street and yet told they’re racist if they stop and search young black men and ‘put hands in pockets’ to check for knives."

He mentioned something that the police call the ‘Betari box’ of human behaviour. This describes a vicious circle: your behaviour influences my behaviour; my behaviour influences your behaviour.

He gave an example of a young and inexperienced police officer on patrol with a more senior colleague in an area of inner London where so-called 'black on black' stabbings and murders are a priority for the police to prevent. The two officers will approach a pair of known street criminals to ask them what they are doing in a particular location. The former senior officer continued, "But as the officers approach, the young men will often start to be abusive, saying: ‘You’re only picking on me because I’m black.’ A big crowd of people will then surround the officers and start to shout, even obstruct them. The police will call for help and help will arrive with sirens blaring; the police will either dominate, or they will run away (withdraw)."

Complaints against the officers will inevitably follow and after a few such incidents the young officers become disillusioned and just go through the motions of policing safe in the knowledge that they are at least unlikely to be complained of as racist if they don't come into confrontational conflict with black people.

The situation is made worse by undoubted occasions, some high profile, where police behaviour has unarguably been racist which fuels the Betari box theory.

Our daughter who was a lay magistrate in England before emigrating to Australia with her husband and sons eleven years ago is a senior lecturer in criminology at an Oz university. She has had books and other papers published on the challenge of balancing the competing interests of offenders, victims and the wider community within/across the criminal justice system. Her research has involved much interaction with such groups as judges, police officers and other professionals as well as victims of crime and perpetrators. I always find it fascinating and illuminating chatting with her about the various aspects of criminal law behaviour and enforcement from so many different angles. Many of us tend to see it from only one perspective. Some of her students are would-be police officers as I understand a degree or equivalent is necessary to become a police officer in Australia, something that is now the case in England and Wales.
 

fight2win

Platinum Member
Mar 10, 2018
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baildon
www.easydrive-yorkshire.co.uk
All I know is we have a deadly world virus that's killing hundreds of thousands of people across the planet and rising, this is a serious situation what must be sorted, I feel so much for all those that have lost their jobs, I know many in this position now from all fields of work and not just in aviation and travel, and it will have a knock on effect for all of us in many ways, but hey it don't matter about those poor souls that are now out of work that have bills to pay , it all just seems to be about the bame community protesting about a known criminal who died in the hands of the police, in the process go against government guidance on social distancing, start protesting attacking and injuring many police officers and causing damage to peoples property, looting etc which is just thuggery! Oh and here in the uk try and re write our history including pulling down status without them knowing anything what so ever about the past, (a good encyclopedia may help) totally disgusting behaviour of which all that certainly live round me agree upon! I know whats coming here and it scares me. Anyway im not going to comment on this anymore as it does really rattle my cage.
 
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