Ryanair

As an outsider, but more importantly as someone who works in policing, drinking culture in the UK crosses all socio-economic backgrounds and not linked to class. However, Airport drinking is a very Anglo phenomenon, but drinking to excess whilst on holiday is also done by Scandinavians and Germans, some of this is linked to alcohol prices at home and some losing inhibitions away from home.
As for the country having a total breakdown, again with my work I do a lot of cross border liaison and many of the issues we have here are mirrored across Europe, and some they have, we have less of.
I do agree though a pint and a fry up before a flight is not something I’d be doing personally, but to each their own.

HX3 said:

I do agree though a pint and a fry up before a flight is not something I’d be doing personally, but to each their own.

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I think for many it's the sign that they're on holiday and that they can enjoy themselves and get away from their daily life.

paully said:

I cant imagine anything I'd like less than any alcoholic drink in the small hours pre dawn...Strong coffee and a bacon sarnie...well now you're talking..
But alcohol at 5am means you really do have a problem

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TBF it's something I have done, and will do again, have an alcoholic drink at 0500/0600, in the right circumstances. However what I will say is that I can control how much I drink and certainly know how to behave on an aeroplane, which clearly can't be said for everyone

Yet 6am Ryanair flights sell alcohol…..pot, kettle?

Finger66 said:

Or perhaps earning too much money if they can afford to get drunk on airport prices!

Seriously though the Locos have brought this on themselves because they have opened flying up to the masses whereas before it was perhaps a little more elitist and to the point raised by @LBA4EVER then perhaps different social standards are now at play

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You mention about these folk earning too much money to get drunk on airport prices, you may well find its the opposite. More the case of paying £25 for their flight to IBZ, ALC, AGP etc and bad money management, always enough money to get drunk and smoke cigs but never enough money to pay the bills and End of the month 50p to their name! And of course where does the money come? Appears half the country live off benefits these days!

“MOL stating FR are having to divert once a day, up from once a week a decade ago, due to bad behaviour on board.” Whilst I wouldn’t dispute that behaviour in public has declined over the last ten years the fact that Ryanair now have to divert more frequently due to poor onboard behaviour may also have something to do with the increased number of Ryanair flights over the last decade.

From my days at the airport, from memory, most people who would get drunk would be people on delayed flights. Maybe the bar should be asking passengers which flight they're on and refusing sale to those on delayed flights?

Could Ryanair ever base the 737 MAX 10 at LBA?

With Ryanair heavily investing in the upcoming high-capacity Boeing 737 MAX 10 (228 seats), it opens up a performance debate for Leeds operations.

Having done some research, even with our full 2,250-metre physical runway length, a maximum-weight MAX 10 ideally wants closer to 2,500 metres of tarmac to get airborne for long-range sectors without restrictions. While short hops to Dublin or Amsterdam wouldn't be an issue, longer sun routes to the Canaries or Greece on hot summer days would likely force severe payload penalties meaning Ryanair would have to leave seats empty to legally meet take-off performance criteria within LBA's declared distances.

Add to that the MAX 10's famously low rotation margin to prevent tail-strikes. How well do we think that stretched fuselage would handle Leeds' undulating runway profile and sloping topography during a gusty crosswind take-off?

Do you think we'll ever see a based MAX 10 here, or is LBA destined to remain a pure MAX 8-200 base while the 10s are sent to the longer, flatter strips down south and across the Pennines?

#LBAMAX10 #RyanairAtLBA

Aviador said:

Could Ryanair ever base the 737 MAX 10 at LBA?

With Ryanair heavily investing in the upcoming high-capacity Boeing 737 MAX 10 (228 seats), it opens up a performance debate for Leeds operations.

Having done some research, even with our full 2,250-metre physical runway length, a maximum-weight MAX 10 ideally wants closer to 2,500 metres of tarmac to get airborne for long-range sectors without restrictions. While short hops to Dublin or Amsterdam wouldn't be an issue, longer sun routes to the Canaries or Greece on hot summer days would likely force severe payload penalties meaning Ryanair would have to leave seats empty to legally meet take-off performance criteria within LBA's declared distances.

Add to that the MAX 10's famously low rotation margin to prevent tail-strikes. How well do we think that stretched fuselage would handle Leeds' undulating runway profile and sloping topography during a gusty crosswind take-off?

Do you think we'll ever see a based MAX 10 here, or is LBA destined to remain a pure MAX 8-200 base while the 10s are sent to the longer, flatter strips down south and across the Pennines?

#LBAMAX10 #RyanairAtLBA

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I'd imagine if LBA is to ever see it it'll likely be from bigger bases like Dublin

Aviador said:

Could Ryanair ever base the 737 MAX 10 at LBA?

With Ryanair heavily investing in the upcoming high-capacity Boeing 737 MAX 10 (228 seats), it opens up a performance debate for Leeds operations.

Having done some research, even with our full 2,250-metre physical runway length, a maximum-weight MAX 10 ideally wants closer to 2,500 metres of tarmac to get airborne for long-range sectors without restrictions. While short hops to Dublin or Amsterdam wouldn't be an issue, longer sun routes to the Canaries or Greece on hot summer days would likely force severe payload penalties meaning Ryanair would have to leave seats empty to legally meet take-off performance criteria within LBA's declared distances.

Add to that the MAX 10's famously low rotation margin to prevent tail-strikes. How well do we think that stretched fuselage would handle Leeds' undulating runway profile and sloping topography during a gusty crosswind take-off?

Do you think we'll ever see a based MAX 10 here, or is LBA destined to remain a pure MAX 8-200 base while the 10s are sent to the longer, flatter strips down south and across the Pennines?

#LBAMAX10 #RyanairAtLBA

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Well landing a max10 with its low to ground but longer length fuselage on R32 may pose problems due to the Touchdown zone been positioned at the point where the runway just goes into the slight downslope (going to hide in the corner from forum members again )
Regardings long sectors to the likes of the canaries and turkey although probably fully fuelled and max passengers most pax usually just carry small cases and bags that fit in overhead lockers, gone have the days where most pax have large 20kg plus cases, so a big weight reduction there.

It would appear that to reduce the risk of tail strikes during rotation Boeing have designed a modified landing gear that increases in length as the aircraft accelerates, giving another 9.5 inches of clearance and after takeoff the gear “shrinks” back to normal dimensions so it fits in the standard wheel well.

I can see Dublin, Krakow, Alicante and Malaga in particular having away based units fly here. I think realistically we're too small of a base for them to bother basing one here. That said, I wouldn't complain if they did base one

LBA4EVER said:

Well landing a max10 with its low to ground but longer length fuselage on R32 may pose problems due to the Touchdown zone been positioned at the point where the runway just goes into the slight downslope (going to hide in the corner from forum members again )
Regardings long sectors to the likes of the canaries and turkey although probably fully fuelled and max passengers most pax usually just carry small cases and bags that fit in overhead lockers, gone have the days where most pax have large 20kg plus cases, so a big weight reduction there.

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Me and my wife have a 10kg bag each….20kg. We always book front row seats if we can and I am fed up of getting on board and all the front over head lockers are full so on our last flight we paid for a 23kg hold bag (didn't know FR offered that before we booked) so we didn't need to pay for priority boarding and 2 cabin bags we just rocked on at the last min and all was good….bags were on the baggage reclaim belt when we got through passport control.….So what I am saying….dont write off 20-23kg hold bags….its like garlic bread….its the future!

LBA4EVER said:

Well landing a max10 with its low to ground but longer length fuselage on R32 may pose problems due to the Touchdown zone been positioned at the point where the runway just goes into the slight downslope (going to hide in the corner from forum members again )
Regardings long sectors to the likes of the canaries and turkey although probably fully fuelled and max passengers most pax usually just carry small cases and bags that fit in overhead lockers, gone have the days where most pax have large 20kg plus cases, so a big weight reduction there.

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What makes this so odd is that Boeing’s entire marketing spiel for the MAX family was about making the aircraft more flexible and suitable for a wider variety of regional airfields. Instead, by stretching the plane to its absolute physical limits without upgrading the wings or aerodynamic surfaces, they created a heavy, low-rotation runway hog.

YorkshireLad said:

I can see Dublin, Krakow, Alicante and Malaga in particular having away based units fly here. I think realistically we're too small of a base for them to bother basing one here. That said, I wouldn't complain if they did base one

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It isn't so much about whether we can fill them or not, it's more about how the aircraft operates. Airports at both ends of the routes need to have a suitable runway which limits many of Ryanairs secondary airports?

And to think that many years ago a cafe regular said we would never see a Ryanair 800 at LBA. Never say never

LBA4EVER said:

(going to hide in the corner from forum members again )

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Don't think you need to on this occasion. It's a very valid point when we are talking Max 10's

Aviador said:

It isn't so much about whether we can fill them or not, it's more about how the aircraft operates. Airports at both ends of the routes need to have a suitable runway which limits many of Ryanairs secondary airports?

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I'm doubtless we can fill them. I'm more thinking operationally as a 3 aircraft base, it might be more convenient to base them in Manchester or EMA for example where they have more aircraft

I feel like runway length wouldn't be too restricting a factor all things considered, we only have a combined 9X weekly flights to far-flung destinations if my memory serves me correctly (2X AGA, ACE, FUE, TFS, 1X CHQ), with most concentrated to within 3 hours of LBA (see DUB, ALC, PMI, AGP, FAO, KRK with 70X weekly flights between them alone)

YorkshireLad said:

I'm doubtless we can fill them. I'm more thinking operationally as a 3 aircraft base, it might be more convenient to base them in Manchester or EMA for example where they have more aircraft

I feel like runway length wouldn't be too restricting a factor all things considered, we only have a combined 9X weekly flights to far-flung destinations if my memory serves me correctly (2X AGA, ACE, FUE, TFS, 1X CHQ), with most concentrated to within 3 hours of LBA (see DUB, ALC, PMI, AGP, FAO, KRK with 70X weekly flights between them alone)

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I think we might be looking at this from a pure demand perspective rather than a scheduling one. There is zero doubt we could fill a 228-seat aircraft out of Yorkshire on almost any route, the demand is absolutely there.

The issue is how Ryanair actually schedules a based aircraft. At a tight 3-aircraft base like LBA, the planes don't just fly short routes all day. To maximize uutilisation a standard based aircraft rotation might look something like this:

Wave 1 (06:00): LBA to Palma (Short)
Wave 2 (12:00): LBA to Tenerife (Long)
Wave 3 (19:00): LBA to Dublin (Short)

If the MAX 10 is weight-restricted on that middle Wave 2 leg to the Canaries or Turkey because of a hot summer afternoon, Ryanair's scheduling computers can't use it efficiently. They can't just leave a based aircraft sitting idle on the apron during the high-yield afternoon peak while a MAX 8 does all the heavy lifting. At a mega-base like Manchester or Stansted with 20+ aircraft, they have the scale to dedicate specific planes to specific lanes. At a 3-aircraft base, every single plane has to be a "jack of all trades" capable of flying any route in the network at any time.

Even if we look at the short hops within 3 hours like Alicante or Malaga on a sticky 25'c July afternoon with a full cabin of 228 passengers, the performance margins on LBA's available take-off run are still going to be incredibly tight for an aircraft with a wing that small.

LBA4EVER said:

Well landing a max10 with its low to ground but longer length fuselage on R32 may pose problems due to the Touchdown zone been positioned at the point where the runway just goes into the slight downslope (going to hide in the corner from forum members again )
Regardings long sectors to the likes of the canaries and turkey although probably fully fuelled and max passengers most pax usually just carry small cases and bags that fit in overhead lockers, gone have the days where most pax have large 20kg plus cases, so a big weight reduction there.

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I'm with you on this one, the runway has been the achilles heel of the airport for years and will be for a long time in the future. Arena need to take another look at this and see if they can come up with a solution otherwise we will always be a bucket and spade airport. We have the potential and a passenger catchment area that could support flights over the pond and the Middle East but airlines are expanding at other UK airports offering these type of flights while we keep using the excuse it will happen when the new terminal is fully open. If I"m going to say Dubai I want to go direct not by two flights involving a change of aircraft in say Turkey with potentially a long lay over.

Aena are professional airport investors and operators. Therefore you have to assume that if major investment in the runway was needed they would have identified that in their due diligence and as a result wouldn’t have invested at all or they would have demanded a deep discount on the valuation.