Em0866

Well-Known Member
Jan 14, 2009
395
28
Cardiff
Have given this some thought, and would be interested in what people think.

What with the recent expansion of routes from BRS with FR, does anyone think that it may give bmibaby a kick in the jacksie for WW to expand routes from CWL? Or is it a lost cause?

You see my thinking is, with the extra flights they will have, surely more and more people from this side of the bridge will travel over to the other side, and passenger numbers from CWL will decrease even more
 
I'm not sure that the Ryanair routes will in themselves make much difference to baby at CWL. Many of them are secondary, even tertiary, routes and not ones that baby would have been likely to consider, or probably anyone else from an airport of BRS's size, except Michael's harped airline.

I am a big supporter of regional airports and BRS is my local and the one I use but I do wonder what FR will do with its extra aircraft there next winter because I can't see many of the new routes being viable in the dark days, and I have to say I am not confident all will succeeed in the summer, especially if the credit crunch slows no sign of lessening.

Back to baby, until LH shows its hand in relation to the entire former British Midland set-up it is difficult to try to judge, or even guess, the direction of baby's future.
 
Thanks Local. Yes will be interesting to see what LH does, no doubt we'll find out soon enough.

I am thinking that some of the routes FR have announced may lure people over the bridge as there is no route from CWL. My example is one of my own. I am going to Madeira for a few days next month, as there is only one weekly flight from CWL, I have been lured over the bridge to fly from BRS with EZY as they have 2 or 3 flights a week which allows me to do this. I am sure that others in and around South Wales do the same thing for other destinations but there is no option for them do this from CWL.

To take your comments on the current credit crunch, it doesn't make a lot of sense why FR have announced such a big expansion from BRS. Time will tell though and will be interesting to see what happens there later in the year and towards W09.
 
The TUI group has axed BRS's Madeira charter operation from this winter, after the First Choice group had operated it for about twenty years, summer and winter. What makes it even stranger is that the TUI EXT and CWL routes to Funchal remain despite carrying far fewer passengers than Bristol did on its Madeira charter route through the summer, and each of the three routes operated on Mondays.

So BRS has no charter operation to Madeira now, only the easyJet sched service that you mentioned.

I think Ryanair had committed to expanding their Bristol operations and so long as the airport does not upset them they will doggedly try to carry it through. MOL did say last year he wanted to be BRS's biggest operator. Well, that could only be done at the expense of easyJet because it is highly unlikely they could both have at least a dozen aircraft based there. The mind boggles!

I understand where you are coming from about choice but there are some routes that would be unlikely to work from both BRS and CWL at the same time because both airports would need passengers from outside their core catchments to make them viable, and the first port of call for these extra passengers is usually their respective neighbour's catchment.

A gap in the market seems to be Scandinavia. The only routes from the South West/South Wales are BRS's two SAS summer-only routes to Oslo and Stockholm, and the latter only operates in July and August. I don't know whether they will return this summer. Many are disappointed that Ryanair did not include at least one Scandinavian route in its announcement this week.

Perhaps baby have looked at Scandinavia and might look again in the light of FR's ignoring that region, especially if SAS don't return to BRS this summer.
 
Strange that TUI group have axed BRS only charter flight to Madeira but have carried on with EXT and CWL, there must method in their madness.

Yes there is need from both airports for a regular Scandanavian route, it's seems the Summer routes to Oslo and Stockholm are geared at tourist market, no thought for the business market at all. I am sure there is plenty of scope to have a year round route from either airport or one or two from one and one or two (to another couple of Scandanavian airports) from the other. Just a thought.

As you said in your earlier posting, we will have to wait until LH decide what they want to do with baby. Maybe that's what others are doing as well. Any idea when this annoucement will be made? I thought it was sometime this month
 
Yes that is true but I was just using Scandanavia as an example. There's Germany which has a big need and Italy as only charters to there at the moment, and that's only in the Summer
 
Em0866 said:
Any idea when this announcement will be made? I thought it was sometime this month

I believe that was the original suggestion but there is now speculation it won't be until February or even March.
 
Thanks Local. As always you are a wealth of information. Much appreciated. I can't help but wonder though why the speculation on the announcement has been "put back". No doubt we'll find out soon enough
 
I find Wikipedia pretty good for many subjects but when it comes to airports they are at the mercy of mischief makers and people who want to see certain routes.

It may be there is overkill on the GLA route but I've heard or read nothing to suggest WW are throwing in the towel.

As for Almeria, this is one not flown from Bristol so might not be a bad punt from CWL.
 
Confirmed on the baby website that Almeria will operate twice weekly (Mon and Fri) this summer.

However, the Glasgow route does not seem bookable this summer even though it is still in the baby web timetable.

If GLA has gone there may be more new routes announced to utilise the aircraft used on that service.

Will also be interesting to see if Flybe increases frequency on the GLA route.
 
New bmibaby service to Almeria
28 January 2009

bmibaby announce new service from Cardiff International Airport

Flights to Almeria commence on 22 May 2009

bmibaby, Cardiff International Airport's largest low cost airline, has today announced a new service to Almeria in Spain. Flights to Almeria will operate from 22 May to 22 October 2009, on Mondays and Fridays. bmibaby expect to carry over 13,500 passengers on the new service over the summer months. Prices start from just £41.99 one way including taxes and charges.

Crawford Rix, managing director, bmibaby, said:

"bmibaby is proud to introduce another new route from Cardiff International Airport. Almeria is currently not served by any other low cost airline from Cardiff, so we are pleased we can offer passengers the chance to travel to a new destination from Wales.

"The South of Spain is an exceptionally popular region and we have introduced this new route in order to offer even more choice from the local airport. Almeria is the next Spanish hotspot and is currently experiencing rapid growth, fuelled by holiday home owners and by travellers wishing to discover the more authentic Spain unspoilt by mass tourism. The city itself offers a rich Moorish heritage and has a picturesque location in a beautiful bay. Services to Almeria will commence on 22 May 2009 and flights will operate on Monday and Friday.

"The airline industry is currently seeing a weakening in demand from consumers for impulsive city breaks and an increase for typical sun destinations; this is a direct result of the current economic climate. In order to meet the demand for more Mediterranean routes from Cardiff, we will be replacing two of our city routes - Amsterdam and Glasgow - with the new route to Almeria. This will enable us to meet the high consumer demand for services to sunny, beach destinations."

Customers holding bookings from Cardiff to Amsterdam and to Glasgow for travel after 29th March 2009 will be contacted by bmibaby as soon as possible and offered an alternative flight or a full refund.

bmibaby is on sale with flights for summer 2009 from Cardiff International Airport to ten other destinations: Alicante, Barcelona, Belfast International, Edinburgh, Faro, Jersey, Malaga, Menorca (Mahon), Murcia and Palma.

For more information visit www.bmibaby.com

From: http://info.cwlfly.com/en/news/3/409/ne ... meria.html

So it is true. WW are cutting Glasgow and Amsterdam for Almeria.

I can see Flybe increasing frequency on GLA and maybe even adding Amsterdam as a new route.
 
Will also be interesting to see if Flybe increases frequency on the GLA route.

Eventually it could become a possibility but at the moment during the current climate i would say no.

I believe Flybe would wait and see how it will effect their passenger figures. At the present moment GLA based aircraft is operating GLA-CWL-CDG-CWL-GLA x Daily except for weekends (1 x daily on sat and sun)

The options available i believe are as follows:-

-> Increase Size of aircraft to Embraer 195. (Don't think is feasable unless loads increase on CWL-CDG-CWL sector)

-> Increase frequency of GLA-CWL-GLA. (This could be done by having the GLA aircraft to operate GLA-CWL-GLA only. The CWL-CDG-CWL sector could then be operated by an aircraft based elsewhere and possibly a new route or from an existing base. eg. NCL-CWL-CDG-CWL-NCL, BHD-CWL-CDG-CWL-BHD or ABZ-CWL-CDG-CWL-ABZ).

The more logical out of the two options above would be the seccond option with an aircraft based at a new destination possibly ABZ-CWL-CDG-CWL-ABZ which follows what they have done previously with BHD and now GLA.

->Option 3 is a base at CWL with CWL aircraft operating the CDG flight with better timings for business passengers and a few new routes to come.

Happy Discussion
 
Hello, mathers. Great to see you back.

You've certainly posted some intriguing scenario variations. A Flybe NQY-CWL route has been in the rumour network recently with most people believing it would not be feasible to operate this sector without linking it to somewhere else, say NQY-CWL-ABZ. However, I'm not sure how practical this would be in terms of aircraft utilisation. Maybe GLA-CWL-NQY-CWL-GLA might be incorporated into the route network if Flybe intends increasing its CWL-GLA frequency at some point.

Also extremely interesting to see what baby does from CWL now they appear to have an aircraft to spare for much of each day.
 
Almeria had a brief spurt of popularity in the mid 1980s (around 1985-87 from memory) when Thomson Holidays and their airline Britannia tried it from a few regional airports.

I know they did it from Bristol but can't recall if they did from Cardiff. Wouldn't be surprised because in those days CWL had a bigger Thomson programme than Bristol.

I might have one family for the route. They have relatives living in that area whom they visit regularly. They have been using easyJet from London (Gatwick I think) because there was nothing local, or occasionally have flown to Malaga locally but it means a long car journey at the Spanish end. I suspect the shorter journey over the Severn Bridge might be more appealing.

I would have thought Almeria should do as well as Murcia which I believe has been most satisfactory, although with Almeria there is no local competition so it might do even better, unless Ryanair look round for somewhere to fly their extra aircraft.

Apparently the reason baby and easyJet (from Bristol) axed their routes to Warsaw despite high loads last summer is the Polish airport's decision to make all airlines pay the high charges of their main terminal. Some other WAW routes from the UK have also gone.
 
I don't think there will be any more new routes by BmiBaby from CWL this year for summer. Schedule on the website only showing the need for 3 aircraft and i can't see aircraft staying on the ground for too long. I believe there maybe an increase in freq of one or two of the current Bucket and spade routes.

I agree with Local Yoke and Planenut that with Almeria not being served at BRS could be a very good move and that WW/BE will no longer be competing on the GLA route.

I hope this new route will go well for them and make them more money than on the GLA and AMS.
 
Re Local's last post, I am 99% sure that there have been no previous flights from CWL to LEI so it will be a brand new destination from CWL. I guess the method of baby's thinking is best to operate the bucket and spade brigade for the time being as mathers has suggested above. It seems for the moment that they are cutting back on business routes and concentrating on sunny spain. Lets hope they do sifficient advertising so that people know of this new route. Plenty of billboards etc around South Wales and the South West
 
I had a look back through old timetables (got them all on my old computer so not too much time needed to peruse) and find that Thomson/Britannia last operated to Almeria from BRS in the summer of 1993.

My memory was playing tricks when I said the mid-1980s because I don't think the route lasted more than a couple of years.

Unfortunately, my timetables for CWL are more sporadic except for the past ten years or so. There was certainly no Almeria route during the past decade.
 
Maybe BMIbaby have a different marketing strategy from CWL or maybe cheapflights.co.uk just thought not to include Cardiff for one reason or another. On the otherhand it does seem silly not to include Cardiff.
 

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