BMIBaby

[TheLocalYokel]

Just to add a bit to planenut's post, by the letter of aviation-speak the airline is correct because 'summer' services usually commence at the end of March each year across the industry, at least in the UK.

A look at the baby timetable shows the baby winter routes from CWL to Geneva and Grenoble continue to mid-April next year.

In the real world no-one would really class these as summer routes but I have said many times that aviation spin is second only to that of government/politicians and a very close second at that.

Can't understand why Geneva is not also a summer route though.

 

[mathers_wales_uk]

I have gone and done some digging, I have been on the BmiBaby website and seen how the site is comparing against the rumours. Here is what i have found.

Winter 09/10 (16 - 22 November)

Looking at the BmiBaby website and can see there will be no Barcelona, Geneva, Grenoble, Mahon, Murcia or Palma

Alicante - x 3 Weekly (Tue, Sat, Sun)
Belfast Int - x 6 Weekly (No Sat Rotation)
Edinburgh - x 13 Weekly (Only one rotation on Saturdays)
Faro - x 2 Weekly (Wed, Sat)
Glasgow - x 6 Weekly (No Sat Rotation)
Jersey - x 1 Weekly (Sat)
Malaga - x 3 Weekly (Tue, Sat, Sun)

Winter 09/10 (25th - 31st January)

Looking at the BmiBaby website and can see there will be no Jersey in addition to the previous. However Geneva and Grenoble will be an addition.

Alicante - x 3 Weekly (Tue, Sat, Sun)
Belfast Int - x 6 Weekly (No Sat Rotation)
Edinburgh - x 13 Weekly (Only one rotation on Saturdays)
Faro - x 2 Weekly (Wed, Sat)
Geneva - x 3 Weekly (Fri, Sat, Sun)
Glasgow - x 6 Weekly (No Sat Rotation)
Grenoble - x 2 Weekly (Fri, Sat)
Malaga - x 3 Weekly (Tue, Sat, Sun)

Summer 2010 (15 - 21 August)

Looking at the BmiBaby website and can see there will be no Glasgow, Geneva or Grenoble. What we will see is same routes as S09 not sure if same frequencies or not. All fights are based on bookable date 15-21 August 2010

Alicante - Daily (Extra Rotation Thursdays)
Barcelona - x 3 Weekly (Mon, Wed, Sat)
Belfast Int - Daily
Edinburgh - x 2 Daily Mon - Fri / 1 x Sunday (No Saturday Rotation)
Faro - x 7 Weekly (Mon-Fri / x 2 Sat No Sunday Rotation)
Jersey - x 3 Weekly (Tue, Thu, Sat)
Mahon - x 2 Weekly (Fri, Sun)
Malaga - x 8 Weekly (Extra Rotation Sundays)
Murcia - x 3 Weekly (Mon, Fri, Sun)
Palma - x 8 Weekly (Extra Rotation on Tuesdays)

 

[Em0866]

That's interesting seeing 7 flights per week to Faro, 8 to Malaga and another 8 to Palma. Seems to me they are filling in where TOM have cut back on these routes, unless I am mistaken

 

[NickCWL]

Great news! It did well 1st time around!

 

[welshguy39]

it looks like grenoble being dropped by baby

 

[Aviador]

[textarea]Cardiff Airport airline plans to cut 158 jobs

FLIGHTS from Cardiff Airport could be affected after a low cost airline announced plans to cut 158 jobs.

Short-haul specialists bmibaby aim to make the cutbacks from its workers at Cardiff, Birmingham and Manchester Airports.

Up to 54 pilot and 82 cabin crew positions at the three airports are at risk of redundancy and 22 management and support positions.

Bmibaby also announced it was reducing the number of aircraft in its fleet from 17 to 12 next year.

Managing director Crawford Rix said it was because the industry is facing its toughest time ever.

He said: “We have to focus our efforts and activities on routes and services we believe are the best fit for our business.” The carrier has started discussions with staff and union representatives with a view to minimising job losses.

Cardiff Airport has bmibaby flights going to Belfast International, Geneva, Edinburgh, Mahon, Palma, Barcelona, Alicante, Murcia, Malaga, and Faro.

Air transport expert Martin Evans, of the Chartered Institute of Logistics and Transport, said: “It looks like it will mean the loss of at least one plane from Cardiff.

“They had already announced a reduction of three to two planes for the winter and it is doubtful we will see its return.

“In the short term, this is very bad news for Cardiff but in the long term it is even worse.

“Unlike other regional airports, Cardiff no longer have a low-cost airline committed to growing routes and passenger numbers from their airport.”

Conservative shadow minister for the economy David Melding AM said: “This is worrying and disappointing news and of particular concern given bmibaby’s significant presence at Cardiff Airport.

“Cardiff Airport is the gateway to Wales for thousands of foreign visitors and provides vital direct links to destinations across Europe and the United Kingdom.

“Securing new routes and attracting new passengers to Cardiff is important if the airport is able to compete with local rivals such as Bristol.”

A Cardiff Airport spokeswoman said: “We were disappointed to hear today of bmibaby’s decision to reduce operations around the UK and at Cardiff Airport.

“We think it is a decision which does not reflect the strength of the Welsh market nor the opportunities we have presented to bmibaby over the years.

“We are already in talks with a number of other airlines about taking advantage of opportunities to serve the Welsh market and believe this announcement will actually encourage other airlines to consider Cardiff Airport.”

Source[/textarea]

 

[Aviador]

Being critical of the airline, I don't think they have been very proactive in promoting and expanding the airline over the years. The airline has struggled to get 'the show on the road', running Bmibaby like their 'failed' bmi mainline and regional operations. The bmi business model effectively operating three airlines with different names hasn't worked.

I remember a few years back when Bmibaby was looking at expanding from my local airport here at Leeds. They decided to open a base at Durham Tees Valley instead. At the time it was a big shock to the airport as all the surrounding airports were expanding their low cost operations. A short time later 'Jet2' a new airline came along announcing flights from the airport with a view to rapidly expand flights from the there. I think everyone was extremely cautious of the airline. After all how could a new airline possibly compete with neighbouring Manchester and Durham Tees Valley airports when they were both handling a substantial amount of low cost flights.

Jet2 has since expanded from Leeds operating to around 37 destinations from the airport. The airline has been constantly proactive in marketing itself and has expanded throughout the North of England and Scotland. In the meantime, both Bmibaby and the low cost arm of Thomson's have continued to retract from airports across the country.

I don't know what will happen to Bmibaby in the future but if the airline carries on as it is then I don't think that they will be around in another couple of years.

If Cardiff can attract an airline such as Jet2 you can guarantee that they will give Cardiff a good bash and having Bristol airport only a short distance away wont put them off.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

baby never did treat CWL seriously - starting and stopping routes seemingly on a whim.

I hate the idea of people losing jobs but the best thing for CWL might be for baby to pull out altogether.

It would leave the field clear for someone else whether Flybe, Jet2 or the waiting-for-the-economy-to-improve FFB.

Tim Lee of FFB has already said they might take on routes abandoned by baby if FFB was not already publicly committed to other routes, but he also said FFB was not interested in domestic routes.

One might think the time to start would be if baby pulled out though things TL has hinted at on the Principality website makes me wonder whether all the finance is readily available at the present time.

If, say Jet2 or Flybe began to build up a decent network, it might make FFB a non-viable starter with nowhere to go.

 

[Aviador]

I'm starting get fed up with the FFB rhetoric. How long can the keep putting off their launch. Bmibaby are almost handing it over to them and they still say they are waiting for the right time. I can't see them ever getting going if they are going to continue to sit back and wait for the so called 'right time'.

 

[Em0866]

You have a good point there Aviador. When is a good time to launch a new airline these days? I now they are just being cautious, but hasn't this run for far too long now? Their website says flights will launch soon, but that's like saying, "how long is a piece of string?". I have questioned on the other forum on when they intend to update their website or even a blog update just so that those who are interested who don't know about these fora know they're still around. This could be a golden opportunity for another airline to come in once we all know which baby routes will be axed. We'll know in good time, but part of me thinks that FFB will miss the boat, I hope I am wrong

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I've just been reading the Principality website and the Administrator, a man called Peter Phillips who is highly experienced in the aviation world especially in marketing and was at CWL until a year or so ago, has written a piece setting out his idealised vision of the future for CWL.

He mentions various things including FFB and for the first time has hinted that this fledging airline may not be able to raise the huge guarantees demanded these days by the CAA for start-ups.

Now I don't know what if any 'inside information' he has concerning FFB but it may be significant that he should make such a comment on a website contributed to regularly by the MD of FFB (Tim Lee), and at least one other senior person in the company.

I wonder whether the comment was made with the tacit approval of Tim Lee as a sort of opening gambit to soften up the many hopeful supporters of FFB who frequent that website.

I hope I am adding 2 and 2 to make 5 and I look for a robust rebuttal from Tim Lee.

Whatever the situation, it does seem a surprising comment to make from the administrator of a board dedicated to the improvement of Welsh air travel if the suggestion lacks any foundation.

Note.

As this really relates to FFB I have copied this post to that forum on the CWL site.

 

[Aviador]

I've just been reading the Principality website and the Administrator, a man called Peter Phillips who is highly experienced in the aviation world especially in marketing and was at CWL until a year or so ago, has written a piece setting out his idealised vision of the future for CWL.

He mentions various things including FFB and for the first time has hinted that this fledging airline may not be able to raise the huge guarantees demanded these days by the CAA for start-ups.

Now I don't know what if any 'inside information' he has concerning FFB but it may be significant that he should make such a comment on a website contributed to regularly by the MD of FFB (Tim Lee), and at least one other senior person in the company.

I wonder whether the comment was made with the tacit approval of Tim Lee as a sort of opening gambit to soften up the many hopeful supporters of FFB who frequent that website.

I hope I am adding 2 and 2 to make 5 and I look for a robust rebuttal from Tim Lee.

Whatever the situation, it does seem a surprising comment to make from the administrator of a board dedicated to the improvement of Welsh air travel if the suggestion lacks any foundation.

Note.

As this really relates to FFB I have copied this post to that forum on the CWL site.

Did the Administrator of that board ever get a response from Tim Lee about the comments he made.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Not so far as I am aware.

Their board is a difficult one to keep abreast of when not visited regularly because the posts don't always appear in chronological order.

It seems that if someone responds to an earlier post in that thread the response post appears immediately after the post commented on which could be several weeks ago, therefore the new response post seems to become buried in previous pages.

It's a horrible, messy system and I'm glad forums4airports is not like it in that sense.

Tim Lee has certainly been active recently on the board and he has returned to one of his favourite topics, that of subsidised routes of which he is an implacable opponent - as I am.

That reminds me to contribute to the CWL main thread on this message board.

 

[Em0866]

Good news! Didn't they fly to Munich when they first started from CWL all those years ago?

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Yes Em, they did.

Good news indeed and let's hope the route is supported.

 

[Em0866]

I thought so, thanks Local. Yes they need to advertise it well, both at the airport and the region as a whole on side of busses, bus stops, anywhere they can. Let's hope there are more routes in the pipeline

 

[Aviador]

That's a great boost for the airport. Those German beer festivals should prove popular!

 

[TheLocalYokel]

It seems the Munich service that only commenced last month is being axed in January - it was due to operate 12 months a year.

Worse than that, other routes have been axed or reduced for summer 2011 with the result that there will be only one based baby aircraft with an additional one at weekends.

Not so long ago there were three based baby aircraft with expectations of a fourth.

CWL has had a dud hand with baby (its been their low cost operator since 2003) that has never exploited the potential of the place.

Supporters of the airport are hoping that at last another airline might be tempted into setting up a decent operation there. It looks as though FlyForBeans is now dead in the water but I suppose never say never.

 

[Aviador]

According to a poster on a certain other site it would appear BMIbaby are to make some substantial custs at CWL for summer 2011.

CWL will be 1 based for Summer 2011 with 2 on Sat/Sun.

Alicante- 3 weekly down from 7.
Belfast - 6 weekly (BHD aircraft)
Jersey- 3 weekly (same)
Malaga- 4 weekly down from 8.
Faro- 4 weekly (same)
Ibiza- 1 weekly down from 2.
Munich - 3 weekly (times clash all over the place for this...got a feeling this is going)
Murica- 2 weekly down from 3.
Edinburgh - Gone
Palma - Showing as 7 weekly but this doesn't fit in timetable so yet to be reduced. Could just fit in 4/5 weekly. Down from 8.

This is very bad news for Cardiff airport. It seems like the airport is in a spiralling decline.

 

[Aviador]

I'd like to think the gradual pull out of Bmibaby is purely for operational reasons and nothing to do with passenger loads or base performance. Unfortunately other airlines don't see it like that. If Bmibaby can't make the routes work what hope has Cardiff got of getting another airline to make them work. On the otherhand if Bmibaby were in a position to make many routes go double daily, other airlines would take note and think they're in with a chance. I tend to think that every flight an airport can get acts as a catalyst to future growth.

Good to see you back on Forums4airports Planenut321. Happy Christmas and I hope the New Year brings better things for CWL.