Security, Immigration & Border Control

[KARFA]

I knew a few people coming through this morning in T1 at various times. Reports for security I saw were:

- about 0630, fast track was busy but still got through in about 15 mins, the regular security queue looked pretty dire
- about 0800, fast track took about 15-20 mins, the normal security was likely to be another hour to get through
- about 0930. fasttrack was fine 30 minutes ago - the rest, not so much
- about 1000, T1 is extremely busy, they are diverting some customers to Security B, fast track available fortunately, long queues otherwise. staff I spoke to complained of staff shortages

 

[paully]

I knew a few people coming through this morning in T1 at various times. Reports for security I saw were:

- about 0630, fast track was busy but still got through in about 15 mins, the regular security queue looked pretty dire
- about 0800, fast track took about 15-20 mins, the normal security was likely to be another hour to get through
- about 0930. fasttrack was fine 30 minutes ago - the rest, not so much
- about 1000, T1 is extremely busy, they are diverting some customers to Security B, fast track available fortunately, long queues otherwise. staff I spoke to complained of staff shortages

Thanks for that KARFA...appreciated..We are going through on a Monday about 4am but will definitely buy the fast track passes.

 

[KARFA]

Thanks for that KARFA...appreciated..We are going through on a Monday about 4am but will definitely buy the fast track passes.

I should have added that although it's pretty bat atm, hopefully by May it will be better as T3 will be open and there should hopefully have addressed the staff shortages.

 

[marni1971]

It’s frankly shocking we’re reporting on paying extra to receive what should be standard service for everyone.

 

[EGCC_MAN]

EGCC_MAN

How was T1 when you arrived at silly O`Clock this morning?...We are going through there at that time in May..All observations gratefully received..

Happy to oblige, though my reply probably won't shed much light. At the time I went through, around 04:15, everything was still very quiet. There was no wait-time to speak of. Pretty much straight through, no issues. Whilst in the departure lounge, I was aware of the place constantly becoming more and more full. Eventually, by around 06:00, the place looked packed. Lots of people standing with seats at a premium. But the queues must have been flowing at a decent rate to get all these people through. Once past 6AM, space eased as an increasing number of flights had their gate numbers displayed.

As others have mentioned, we are in the unusual situation of both Ryanair and EasyJet passengers being processed through the same channels. If this changes when T3 reopens, the situation will change entirely, so that will be important to watch. The crucial factor will be whether T3's in-house security hall reopens, or whether the plan is to feed all T3 passengers through the T1 security channels. We should know soon enough.

On my return back to T1 last night (23:47 on stand), a pleasant surprise. I was braced for mega-queues like last Sunday night, but that didn't happen. We got Gate 23 - one of the closest gates to UK Border, so a relatively short walk. And we were the only flight being processed through for those few minutes which made for a really quick transit. I was basically through without delay.

Luck is a big factor with these things. Watching back on FR24, a further clutch of flights arrived in sequence starting about ten minutes after we landed. But we were sorted by then. I guess that the queues would have been more interesting 20-30 minutes after we passed through.

But for me, it was another positive experience on the day. All good, staff friendly and helpful, no grounds for complaint. Next trip will be on Friday, another day return. I'll report back again on that one.

 

[CM.]

I’m hoping the issues will be sorted ASAP as I’ll be flying with Easyjet from Manchester in September.

 

[EGCC_MAN]

I am happy to answer your questions on specific airports by PM if you need advice. It isn’t relevant to this thread which relates to MAN and where I have never attempted a back to back. Why don’t you risk the offence and see where it gets you?

KARFA - There is good reason why I return to this topic, and I contend that it is absolutely relevant to this thread despite your protestations. Note also that not one poster has raised any objection to our discussing the risks associated with back-to-back transits on here.

To summarise, I asked you about your experience of undertaking back-to-back transits at major airports, which your linked log shows you doing on a regular basis. Given that this is an extremely high-risk practice for most, I thought that you might be able to give forum members some pointers about how you make this work, but - for whatever reason - you have evaded answering, except to imply that it is no big deal and not brave to attempt.

Readers on here are probably exclusively aviation enthusiasts. We're under no obligation to answer any question, but I do think that we have a responsibility to avoid leaving a misleading impression which may prove detrimental to another forum member. Your flying log shows you to be an experienced frequent flyer. But ... so am I. And based upon my own experience, I would strongly urge avoiding bookings which involve returning to origin airport on the same aircraft as the outbound flight, where a standard one hour turnaround (or less) applies. This would generally work on a small commuter aircraft to a remote island or small-town airport (tell the crew you're reboarding for the return), but on Airbus / Boeing types at major airports this invites trouble. Allowing ten minutes for deplaning, and presuming boarding commences at twenty minutes before pushback, you have around thirty minutes to exit through arrivals (and border if international), sprint to departures, negotiate outbound security and leg it back to the departure gate. Athleticism isn't sufficient, you need to be lucky too. Because if you hit the back of even a moderate queue, you're stuffed. You miss your flight. And for most regular passengers, this will be a significant risk. There are still afew airports where deplaning passengers mingle with departing passengers (meaning you can stay near the gate), but relatively few in Europe these days (for non-schengen UK-originating pax), and none of size in the UK.

If anyone here is tempted to emulate your back-to-back style itineraries (because you're giving the impression that they're a doddle), my advice is DON'T TRY IT. You will soon be caught out, and probably sooner rather than later. I've flown through 464 different airports ... I'm no rookie at this stuff. And I've actually made many quick turnarounds ... but only with contingency in place (standby pass, so no financial-loss implications / delayed flight leaving short interline time / airline responsible for getting you on the next departure etc.). Some flights I have made, some I have missed. But I've never put myself in the position of being stranded or having to buy myself a new ticket at the expensive on-the-day fare. For you, cost of airfare appears to be inconsequential. For others here, it very much will be.

Now, I also said that arriving and leaving on the same aircraft on a typical one hour turnaround would represent a major challenge for most people. But not for all. There is a group to whom none of the above applies. Those associated with the airline. Those who have no obligation to leave the aircraft and the gate area. Taking the example of a British Airways cabin attendant, their duty flying roster would include back-to-back sequences which very closely resemble your own. Such a person would never miss the turnaround departure, because they stay with the aircraft. They only exit through arrivals formalities at the end of their (multi-sector) duty, and even then - if uniformed airline staff - they exit through a discrete express channel unavailable to regular fare-paying passengers. Of course, short-haul crew members such as these will ratchet up far more flights than passages through airport security and immigration. And they will rarely be required to join the potentially lengthy queues which their passengers routinely negotiate. Perhaps such people would not be best placed to critique mainstream security procedures at the airports served by their flights. And, of course, they wouldn't consider it stressful or brave to make a departure on a quick turnaround. But it's very important that such a person should not leave the impression that it is similarly easy for a regular punter to attempt, based upon what they read on a forum such as this.

If [forum members] you're not affiliated with an airline in some way which allows you to remain with the aircraft during turnaround, don't try something like this. You might get away with a couple of times if you're lucky and fit, but you'll soon come unstuck.

 

[KARFA]

I am still struggling to see what this has to do with Manchester airport which is what this thread relates to, you do seem particularly obsessed.

Nevertheless, to be clear I am not advocating anyone do anything in relation to any type of travel. I very much doubt anyone who has even bothered to look at my flight record I linked to is somehow remotely interested in copying any part of it. All I am telling you is in my case, with the airports and airlines I travel one, there was no bravery involved. I haven't got close to missing anything. There is a reason I have done it at some, but would never attempt it at others - to bring it back on topic I would never try a back to back at MAN for example for fairly obvious reasons.

If you care to ask about a specific airport I can try and give you a view on whether a back to back is possible. If you are going to keep talking in generalities I really can't give you anything other than general answers back. Some airport are fine, some are not. I pick the ones I choose to do it carefully and I have never got close to being stranded. You asked about AGP earlier, and I said that isn't possible if arriving from the UK, we both agreed on that.

Another poster gave you a big hint up thread of a comprehensive resource outside this forum which deals with back to backs. Plenty of people read that and choose where to do them, often the reason can be to start a cheap fare for example.

I thought I have been clear earlier, but to emphasise - I am not and have never been employed, had any role in, or have any affiliation to an airline or aviation in general. I get no special privileges as you put it, for the purposes of travel I am a regular punter. I do not remain on aircraft during turnarounds.

 

[EGCC_MAN]

KARFA - I didn't ask you about AGP earlier. I just happened to mention in passing that it was my next destination (prior to yesterday). I've used that airport on multiple occasions and am well acquainted with it's advantages and limitations. As for your professional role - I didn't speculate on that. I spoke in generic terms, citing the example of a British Airways cabin attendant. I didn't state that you were one, because I don't know you. Though your pattern of flights would not be inconsistent with that role.

But I do stand by my point that it is irresponsible to promote the impression that back-to-back flights are no sweat. They're extremely high-risk, and I again emphasise to all here that you should undertake serious research before attempting one. You do need to be 'brave' for most of them. And the reason for that is the challenges presented by negotiating security, immigration and border control against the clock. Ah yes - the very title of this thread. That's why I discuss the issue here.

 

[KARFA]

The thread is "security, immigration and border control" within the Manchester airport board. You would assume discussions in here predominantly relate to Manchester airport.

You asked about my back to backs after looking through my flight history and I stand by my comment that I have not had to be brave for mine. As I have noted, they are not selected at random, and I have not come close to missing any. If you care to ask about any specific ones I can tell you my specific advice. I have no idea where you travel or with what airlines so I have no idea if my experiences would be remotely relevant to your travel, I can only answer for my own travel. You raised the topic of back to backs I have done and asked whether they required any bravery generally, I have told you my answer.

To state yet again - I am not promoting anything or advocating anyone copy anything I do - and tbh I doubt anyone would be interested in copying anything I do anyway.

 

[EGCC_MAN]

You continue to promote the impression that back-to-backs are easy. They're not, and my concern is that a less-experienced traveller could be misled by that. It is irrelevant whether a reader may choose a route which you have flown or not. The same principle applies, and I have highlighted the risks for the benefit of any unsuspecting readers on here.

Only you appear to be obsessed with defining qualifying subject-matter for this thread. I have told you my reasons why this thread is appropriate IMO. However, we have made our respective opinions known now, so we can move on from this particular topic unless any new material is forthcoming.

 

[KARFA]

You continue to promote the impression that back-to-backs are easy.

As noted this is a topic you have raised and kept pushing. Had you not asked then I wouldn't have been commenting on back to backs at all. If you have specific questions on any of the airports I have done them at, feel free to ask about those specific airports.

They are easy depending on where and with which airlines you pick, as I have noted several times now mine are not chosen at random. I have not generalised and said all back to backs in all airports are easy, that would be completely incorrect. However, the ones I specifically have done have been easy. There are many I would say are brave or even suicidal and which I would not advise anyone to do, as I noted before AGP and MAN would be two I may put in that category and would not attempt.

They're not, and my concern is that a less-experienced traveller could be misled by that. It is irrelevant whether a reader may choose a route which you have flown or not. The same principle applies, and I have highlighted the risks for the benefit of any unsuspecting readers on here.

I don't imagine the less experienced traveller is reading a thread about "Airports in the UK>>Manchester>>Security, Immigration & Border Control" on forums4airports looking for tips on doing back to backs at other airports around the world. But just in case they are, if anyone has any specific questions for specific airports they should raise them and they will hopefully get advice whether it is doable or not - they shouldn't assume either way. Also as has been noted upthread, there are other frequent flyer forums which folks can get advice from if they wish where there are comprehensive guides to back to backs at numerous airports.

 

[EGCC_MAN]

The readership on F4A is overwhelmingly made up of aviation enthusiasts, exactly the people who would be most likely to consider a back-to-back itinerary if led to believe that it is a breeze. Hopefully this exchange will persuade them to do their homework before attempting a risky trip.

 

[Scottie Dog]

I do believe gentlemen that this particular part of the discussion should now be put to bed. The input from both parties - I refer of course to EGCC_MAN and KARFA - has been well documented with arguments, both for and against.

 

[paully]

I`d like to thank both KARFA and EGCC_MAN for their timely updates to my question about the security, at present, at Manchester. I agree that the big question will be when they reopen T3, will they have sufficent resources to operate its own security lines or will it still funnel everyone through T1 for this specific purpose?. I guess we won`t have too long to wait to find out. If there are any other members with personal experience, please post. Thanks in advance.

 

[KARFA]

Another report from someone I know from yesterday evening at T1

Departure at 18.10 and arrived 1.5 hours prior. The security queue was way down to the Emirates check in. Fast track was full of people, being pulled from the main queue to get there flights. The staff were good at pulling people out to the front. After 45 mins, I was nowhere near the front and was also pulled to the front. Luckily my bags was not stopped otherwise, I would have missed the flight.

In terms of trying to discern a pattern, it seems midweek and mid afternoon are much better, but weekends and mid morning or early evening can be bad.

Also I have heard many of the low cost carriers in T1 are continuingly complaining to MAG about the situation - the airlines are very aware of the problem.

 

[Silvercity]

Another report from someone I know from yesterday evening at T1

Departure at 18.10 and arrived 1.5 hours prior. The security queue was way down to the Emirates check in. Fast track was full of people, being pulled from the main queue to get there flights. The staff were good at pulling people out to the front. After 45 mins, I was nowhere near the front and was also pulled to the front. Luckily my bags was not stopped otherwise, I would have missed the flight.

In terms of trying to discern a pattern, it seems midweek and mid afternoon are much better, but weekends and mid morning or early evening can be bad.

Also I have heard many of the low cost carriers in T1 are continuingly complaining to MAG about the situation - the airlines are very aware of the problem.

At one time I used to use MAN more frequently ( normally term 1 or 3 ), but because of the issues you described I tend to avoid it.

 

[Llandudno]

there were also 3 hour queues at Geneva yesterday, but I notice you haven’t rushed to research that. I’ll say it again, it’s strange that people want to seemingly take delight in highlighting issues at MAN in isolation and going out of their way to do so, when other airports are also facing issues.

im not saying these issues at MAN are not valid, but the MAN ‘hate’ on here is tiresome, you lot all disappear with nothing to say when there’s good news but are almost frequent posters when it comes to slagging the place off.

 

[A400]

This is the Manchester thread for security so you will expect things to do with Manchester to be in here?

Nether-less I’m sure Manchester are aware of these issues and sorting them as summers fast approaching and more flights brings more passengers so these issues need to be addressed promptly.

 

[marni1971]

This is the Manchester thread for security so you will expect things to do with Manchester to be in here?

Nether-less I’m sure Manchester are aware of these issues and sorting them as summers fast approaching and more flights brings more passengers so these issues need to be addressed promptly.

They’re aware. But they can’t magically pull the amount of staff required out of thin air.