KLM

[Jerry]

KLM November 2016 stats were 10,837

 

[Jerry]

KLM November 2016 stats were 10,837

 

[Severn]

KLM - November 2016 - 10,837 - 75% Load Factor

 

[superking]

KLM - November 2016 - 10,837 - 75% Load Factor

with all yr load factors you posting are you taking into account different sized aircraft. KLM have been using 3 different types on the route.

 

[Severn]

with all yr load factors you posting are you taking into account different sized aircraft. KLM have been using 3 different types on the route.

I am well aware of the different types of aircraft used which is why I used the logs to work out exactly which flights operated and on which type of aircraft. Therefore the LF should be very accurate, unless I've done some silly maths errors.

 

[Jerry]

The last flight of the Fokker 70 to and from CWL is scheduled on the 28th October 2017. 09.20 arrival and 10.00 departure. Looks like for the W17/18 that CWL will be an all E175 service. That will guarantee 528 seats a day over 6 flights.
Personally I think CWL will be an all E175 service from then but we'll have to wait and see for that.

 

[Jerry]

Got the times wrong. 09.50 arrival and 10.20 departure

 

[CraigW92]

I was looking at an interesting graph yesterday with regards to AMS KL flights, seems to give an interesting and clear view as to which airports benefit from competition and which ones don't, the top 5 airports with the highest fare here have no competition and are all KL only:

1 operator ABZ- KL
1 operator MME- KL
1 operator NWI- KL
1 operator HUY- KL
1 operator CWL- KL

SOU being a newly introduced route will mean the lowest yield, BE also compete on the route to be noted

NCL and BHD also have no competition on the route ( BFS has EZY nearby)

Credit to routes online and also Sabre for the graph,

http://www.routesonline.com/news/29...-the-london-city-market/?highlight=humberside

View attachment 4533

 

[Jerry]

When it comes to KLM at Cardiff I don't think any competition would effect there prices. Flybe could do a daily AMS and fill it and the KLM flights would be the same. Most of the KLM pax head long haul rather than point to point. I personally find no difference in prices between KLM Cardiff or Bristol when comparing for my flight to Portland. What will make them cheaper is bigger aircraft and more daily seats. Last summer I noticed point 2 point prices were cheaper on the E190 rotation than on the Fokker rotations. When it becomes an all E175 service then prices might come down a bit. The only complaint that I have is that there is no lunchtime rotation for my return flight and as a consequence I'm looking at returning via CDG now as there is a Air France codeshare on the Flybe 13.00 arrival from CDG.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

The conclusion that seems to be drawn from this appears to be a higher yield per passenger on KLM's CWL-AMS than on many of the airline's other AMS-UK routes. Other factors have a bearing on yield of course so it's not possible to be certain.

I've wondered for a couple of years or more about a fourth daily rotation from CWL. I don't know whether the fleet will be increased in size when all the E 175s enter service. If it is that might be the time when increased CWL frequencies will occur.

In the 1990s and early 'noughties' my wife and I used the KLM AMS service quite a lot (from BRS) either for visits to the Netherlands for or for onward transatlantic journeys. During this time the aircraft went from Saab 340 to Fokker 50, with the Fokker 70 being introduced on one or two rotations.

CWL fared broadly similarly and in fact had one more daily rotation than BRS at times then - up to five daily. One of the daily rotations operated AMS-BRS-CWL-AMS. I remember catching this 'double drop' service on one occasion at AMS during the late afternoon. I think it was the first time I'd flown on a KLM F 70 which had been newly introduced to the route at that time.

 

[Jerry]

I don't know whether the fleet will be increased in size when all the E 175s enter service. If it is that might be the time when increased CWL frequencies will occur.

According to Wikipedia there is still 12 more E175s to arrive with 5 active at the moment so the fleet will end up 30 E190's and and 17 E175's. From what i've read on other forums i don't think KLM will have the aircraft to add anymore rotations to CWL as they seem to have had a spat with Alitalia and have opened up a MXP route the same with Air France also some Italy routes as well Gdansk, Graz and Split. Their fleet seems pretty stretched at the moment though there has been a few increases here and there for airports like Inverness and i wouldn't be surprised if their aircraft were each doing a minimum of 6 rotations a day. If CWL wants a 4th daily AMS then it might have to be done by Flybe though a 2nd daily CDG might give CWL more Skyteam connections.

 

[superking]

It was all in place last summer to operate 2 rotations per day on a 738 I never heard what happed with that,or mentioned since.this was on the brs rotations. with things like this it would free up some of the e190/e175 aircraft to add new routes or increase others.

 

[Jerry]

KLM and KLM Cityhopper do seem to have blurred lines. There are airports like LHR BHX and EDI which you'd expect to be wholly mainline but are mixed then airports like BRS which you'd expect to be mainline yet are all Cityhopper and NCL which is all mainline instead of Cityhopper. Could there be some sort of stipulation that says that certain airports have to have Cityhopper flights

 

[TheLocalYokel]

It was all in place last summer to operate 2 rotations per day on a 738 I never heard what happed with that,or mentioned since.this was on the brs rotations. with things like this it would free up some of the e190/e175 aircraft to add new routes or increase others.

KLM and KLM Cityhopper do seem to have blurred lines. There are airports like LHR BHX and EDI which you'd expect to be wholly mainline but are mixed then airports like BRS which you'd expect to be mainline yet are all Cityhopper and NCL which is all mainline instead of Cityhopper. Could there be some sort of stipulation that says that certain airports have to have Cityhopper flights

I wondered about CWL and BRS with KLM Cityhopper. Unlike the other UK Cityhopper routes that came about via Air UK/KLM UK those at CWL and BRS were the result of Netherlines/NLM Cityhopper serving the Severnside airports.

I asked a question before Christmas in the LBA KLM thread and was told by a poster there who seems well acquainted with KLM operations that there is no restriction on operating KLM Boeing 737s on the routes to CWL and BRS.

 

[Jerry]

I asked a question before Christmas in the LBA KLM thread and was told by a poster there who seems well acquainted with KLM operations that there is no restriction on operating KLM Boeing 737s on the routes to CWL and BRS

CWL could do with a 737 in August! Looks like CWL will get a reduction in seats from KLM in August. Looks like April to July it'll be roughly 2 E175s a day and 1 Fokker 70 then in August it looks like an all Fokker 70 schedule then in September and October it'll go back to 2 E175s and 1 Fokker. It'll be roughly 492 seats a day compared to 420 in August but from November onwards there will be 528 with 3 E175s a day. If a 4th were ever added for 2018 then it would be 704 seats a day. BRS looks like it'll be mostly 4 E190's a day with 800 seats a day. Bearing that figure in mind i can't see CWL getting a 4th daily flight anytime soon.

 

[NOSIGWX]

I think we'll see proof of this in the not too distant future.

 

[Jerry]

Hopefully in August and CWL can get the 190s then! At BRS would they have to move stands? As I believe they have a dedicated one? The same at CWL which is stand 9.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Hopefully in August and CWL can get the 190s then! At BRS would they have to move stands? As I believe they have a dedicated one? The same at CWL which is stand 9.

I can't answer that because I don't know but last summer a poster well versed in BRS operations posted this on the BRS Air France/KLM thread.

It's not uncommon to see the KLM on stands 3/5/6 and 22.

 

[NOSIGWX]

I can't answer that because I don't know but last summer a poster well versed in BRS operations posted this on the BRS Air France/KLM thread.

It's not uncommon to see the KLM on stands 3/5/6 and 22.

In the last 12 months I can think of maybe one occasion where the KLM has been parked on a different stand to the usual 21. It could be an issue if a larger aircraft is used, as the dedicated KLM lounge is adjacent to stand 21.

 

[Jerry]

I just seen an advert for KLM on TV. It's advertising flying from your local airport rather than a bigger airport and advertises the plus of staying in bed instead of a long stressful journey to big airport. This is the first time i've ever seen KLM advertise on TV.