Air Canada

[Scottie Dog]

Thanks for that update which I had not seen before. You're right in saying that if Rouge lose the right equipment, and Air Transat fold, then I don t see any other carrier replacing them.

Fingers crossed.

 

[Coathanger16]

If Rouge and Air Transat disappear, so will many European connections to Canada.

With about 10% fewer seats than Rouge's 767s, I would have thought Mainlines 787-8s would have been a good fit for Manchester? Given Manchester to Toronto saw just under 150,000 pax in 2019, a daily 788 would have a 80% LF if all passengers stayed.

Failing Air Canada, might Westjet be interested in the MAN - YYZ market? Didn't they have plans to launch some flights from MAN to Halifax?

 

[Scottie Dog]

Things appear to have gone a little quiet at the moment with regards to the merger. Whilst shareholders have agreed the merger it would appear, according to Western Aviation News on 30th March, that it is now down to the Canadian government to formalize the proposal:

Transport Minister Marc Garneau has given himself until May 2 to conduct what’s called a public interest review of the Air Canada-Air Transat merger, though the pandemic may force him to extend that deadline.


You are correct as far as Westjet is concerned. They had planned to start a Manchester to Halifax service for the summer 2020 season but this has been put on hold. Whether they would be interested in taking on the Toronto and Vancouver routes would certainly be a good question.

 

[David_itl]

Rouge is going from MAN.. What we are getting is A330s! Per airlineroute:

Toronto – Manchester eff 04JUN21 A330-300 replacing rouge 767, 5 weekly (1 daily from 28JUN21)

https://www.routesonline.com/news/3...67-service-replacement-as-of-1800gmt-22jul20/

 

[Scottie Dog]

From yesterday's Airlineroutes.

Toronto – Manchester eff 04JUN21 A330-300 replacing rouge 767, 5 weekly (1 daily from 28JUN21)

 

[CM.]

Air Canada will use an A330-300 on the Toronto route next Summer it was originally going to be the 737-max so this is welcome.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1424306779387797507

 

[Chilly Dog]

Perhaps this thread should be re-named.

AC have just uploaded their northern Summer 22 schedule. Subject to change obviously.

They have changed the MAN schedule - but key is that it remains 5 weekly, and on 333 aircraft Air Canada.

Daily except Monday and Saturday:

.2345.7 MAN YYZ 1115 1400 AC 809 333*C

Runs from 2 June to 30 Sep.

 

[CM.]

Summer 2023 will see Air Canada use a B787-8 Dreamliner in its Manchester-Toronto route. There’s speculation that that AC may fly to Manchester daily but at present remains 5 weekly.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1526583556306264064

 

[A400]

It’s confirmed @CM. They will fly daily from next summer using the 787-8 Dreamliner. 15th June it starts

https://twitter.com/x/status/1542418691467448323

 

[David_itl]

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230130-acns23

5 weekly A330s now pushed back to 17th June

 

[Land23R]

The A333 has about 30 more seats than the B788 I believe, but the summer service is now only 3.5 months instead of 4.5 months initially planned.
And at one stage it was going to be daily from mid-June. Edinburgh seems to have been unaffected.
I guess if your glass is half full, it's a relief AC are still operating. Half empty and its more slightly disappointing news on longhaul.

 

[David_itl]

another change of plan,. It's now 5 weekly Omni Air 767s for the 1st month of operation and for some reason, have altered flight numbers to AC2410/2411 for this period.

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230424-acman

 

[mullion]

Sounds like an aircraft shortage

 

[Timberwolf]

Pity they can't use one of the 2 Air Canada A330s in the Manchester STS hangar if one of them is finished by mid June.

 

[Land23R]

It was going to be daily with a B788, then back to 5 x weekly with the A333, and the already short season reduced further. Now we have an Omni B767 for the first month.

Suggestions on other forums and twitter that this smells of a manged decline, rather like AA did at MAN, and I can understand the scepticism.

If the B767 proves unreliable and unpopular, with passengers looking at alternatives, it could be an excuse for AC to drop the route, blaming the market, lack of yield etc. If it is an aircraft shortage, unfortunately MAN all too often seems to be first in line to suffer the consequences.

At least Air Transat are year round albeit with a limited frequency outside of summer. Does the A321LR showing in October have a premium cabin?

 

[BlueManc]

Does the A321LR showing in October have a premium cabin?

187 standard + 12 Club (38 pitch recliners)

 

[Coathanger16]

it could be an excuse for AC to drop the route

Since when did an airline need an excuse to drop a route?

Aircraft shortages are well documented, with Air Canada likely being affected by the numerous B787 delivery delays.

https://simpleflying.com/air-canada-first-new-boeing-787-dreamliner-since-2019/

 

[Land23R]

You selected only part of that sentence Coathangar and I would suggest the previous para is also relevant in the context. Of course aircraft shortages are well documented; it's just unfortunate from MAN's perspective that they are often affected.

Those of us with long memories can recall what happened on the railways in some cases. Frequencies were reduced, fares made unattractive, poor and unreliable equipment was provided, and then closure of a line could be justified.

Aviation and airlines are different and I'm not saying personally this is what is happening with Air Canada or that dropping the route is inevitable; but I can understand if some read the signs that way. Let's see what happens.

sorry, missed a bit out and too late to edit.

"and then closure of a (rail) line could be justified" when passenger numbers not surprisingly dropped.

 

[Timberwolf]

Since when did an airline need an excuse to drop a route?

Aircraft shortages are well documented, with Air Canada likely being affected by the numerous B787 delivery delays.

https://simpleflying.com/air-canada-first-new-boeing-787-dreamliner-since-2019/

I think it's more to do with how markets have changed from North American airlines to the UK regional.

Seems to be more about flying Canadian and US citizens to the UK tourists spots now, London and Edinburgh.As opposed to flying Brits as the majority to North America as it was in the past.

That would explain why Air Canada is flying some many flights to EDI from early June, all the way through to early Jan 2024 .Supposedly daily until 28th June then 3 weekly from 29 Oct till early Jan.

Supposedly on B789s

Manchester heavily reduced now, and Birmingham with no flights at all.

Air Canada are not the cheapest, so I wouldn't be overly happy to pay full walk with them, then to find I'm getting on a 21 yrs-28yr old Omni 767 ,some more akin to doing trooping flts.

 

[Nethercote2019]

The U.K. to Canada VFR is dieing out literally I’m afraid, there used to be flights from everywhere incl LBA EXT etc
As usual LHR to Canada is where it’s all happening ! BA to Toronto 6 x a day etc, so it’s either 1 stop or down the M40