KLM

[BCFC]

Totally fed up seeing KLM posts constantly.

 

[Finger66]

If this carries on KLM is going to start standing for Keep Losing Money.

And if easyJet don't jump on they will be Keeping Leeds Monopoly.

 

[SierraHotel]

KL1018 due to be operated by Eastern E190, cancelled.

 

[Finger66]

Think this was a planned one due to AMS capacity limitations, nothing more. Unless anyone can correct me on that one.

 

[LBAYORKIE]

KL1018 due to be operated by Eastern E190, cancelled.

The situation is untenable. This service must be reliable. Connections need to be made!

Think this was a planned one due to AMS capacity limitations, nothing more. Unless anyone can correct me on that one.

The reason for these cancellations and delays is irrelevant to the pax. Presumably those with connections have been taken to MME, HUY or MAN.

 

[Finger66]

Whilst no one is happy with this service in its current form these cuts have been planned to the KLCH network at several airports, it is not just an LBA thing.

That said, everything that is going on with our AMS schedule is clearly going to do some major damage to its reputation so KLM probably need to get some publicity out here.

It's been said before, but is some service better than no service? Yes that's extreme but falling pax numbers may send it that way and is why it's up to KLM to do something about it - publicity stating capacity limitations would be a good start. They can't be coming out and also stating what everyone knows about T3

 

[jason1-11]

Whilst no one is happy with this service in its current form these cuts have been planned to the KLCH network at several airports, it is not just an LBA thing.

That said, everything that is going on with our AMS schedule is clearly going to do some major damage to its reputation so KLM probably need to get some publicity out here.

It's been said before, but is some service better than no service? Yes that's extreme but falling pax numbers may send it that way and is why it's up to KLM to do something about it - publicity stating capacity limitations would be a good start. They can't be coming out and also stating what everyone knows about T3

Just checked on FR24, pre 9am this morning only 2 flights have been cancelled: Leeds and Krakow.

 

[lbaspotter]

Think this was a planned one due to AMS capacity limitations, nothing more. Unless anyone can correct me on that one.

This mornings flight cancellation is not due to the slot restrictions or Capacity issues at Amsterdam and it’ not KLM’s fault.

It’s because the LBA based / night-stopping Eastern Airways Embraer 190, G-CLSN has gone tech yet again. If they get it fixed It will be positioning out empty to Amsterdam at 14:15 as “EZE054P”

One has to wonder how much longer KLM will let this can carry on for?

 

[Finger66]

This mornings flight cancellation is not due to the slot restrictions or Capacity issues at Amsterdam and it’ not KLM’s fault.

It’s because the LBA based / night-stopping Eastern Airways Embraer 190, G-CLSN has gone tech yet again. If they get it fixed It will be positioning out empty to Amsterdam at 14:15 as “EZE054P”

One has to wonder how much longer KLM will let this can carry on for?

Thanks @lbaspotter happy to have been corrected.

Re how much longer, all I would say is potentially watch this space.

 

[pug]

This mornings flight cancellation is not due to the slot restrictions or Capacity issues at Amsterdam and it’ not KLM’s fault.

It’s because the LBA based / night-stopping Eastern Airways Embraer 190, G-CLSN has gone tech yet again. If they get it fixed It will be positioning out empty to Amsterdam at 14:15 as “EZE054P”

One has to wonder how much longer KLM will let this can carry on for?

Seven years with option to extend, that’s how long.

 

[BCFC]

Seven years with option to extend, that’s how long.

Why would you choose to fly long haul from LBA via AMS with these ? The simple fact is you wouldn't!

 

[pug]

Why would you choose to fly long haul from LBA via AMS with these ? The simple fact is you wouldn't!

They aren’t, it’s KLM pure and simple. When I book a Jet2 holiday I don’t intend on flying with ETF but invariably if it ends up being on one of their aircraft then there’s no getting around it.

Interested to know why you think they’re clowns? Yes it’s chaos there at the moment but actually that’s chaos caused by trying to make it work. Tech issues are unavoidable and if anyone thinks that KLM are not aware of those risks I’ve got a bridge to sell them.. Why do you think KLM have made their own former aircraft available to Eastern on what I understand to be very good terms? It wouldn’t be because KLM also recognise its chaos but really want it to work too, would it?

I obviously enjoy spending time on this forum but sometimes I do feel like people need to see the bigger picture here, because there is one and it doesn’t all centre around LBA! KLM do not have the resources to operate the schedule themselves, if they didn’t have Eastern then how do you think the service would run any better? It might be a bitter pill to swallow but it’s the truth nonetheless.

I think we’d all prefer the schedules to revert back to KLC, but for various reasons this is not possible and KLM have signed a long term contract for these services to be outsourced. There aren’t many E-Jet operators in the U.K. or indeed Europe so as you can probably imagine it’s tricky to get the right level of qualified staff, this has been compounded by Brexit where engineers and pilots must have the requisite qualifications to work on G-Reg aircraft. This just adds to the already challenging jobs market. If anything it’s KLM pushing more onto Eastern that is causing the problems because when you look at their HUY and MME services it seems to be running quite smoothly as they’re established.

 

[Jerry]

Seven years with option to extend, that’s how long

That's good for Eastern gives them some stability.

 

[pug]

That's good for Eastern gives them some stability.

Well, in theory yes. I’ve had to explain this elsewhere but before anyone starts claiming I’m an Eastern apologist..

The staff really want it to work, but the problem is as I understand from the outside that they get told about this contract and it’s very much a case of ‘make it work or you’ll be out of a job’. It’s very tricky to plan with such limited resources and high demands to get the contract moving and expand - which is the intention here. I’ve said this before but the guy at the top is very good at winning contracts but it’s a different story when it comes to forward planning. The rot here set in when it was purchased by Bristow and I understand all decisions had to be made via Texas which as you can imagine is not efficient. Indeed this is the issue at HUY at present as it’s still majority owned by Bristow.

In the interests of objectivity, and as I’ve said before, the ideal scenario here is that KLM buy a controlling share in the business and run it as an arms length operation on a U.K. AOC. This could offer stability and longevity in the operation. What we don’t want to see is KLM abandoning Eastern and not having the capacity to re-absorb the network back into KLC, because the only viable outcome of that is network withdrawal.

I know people feel KLM should transfer LBA over to mainline, and I’m sure the LBA management will be in conversation with KLM over this too, but for whatever reason KLM have decided not to do this, at least for the moment, so the best bet is to try look for the positive. At least this venture is creating local jobs and opportunities whereas before they’d abandoned their U.K. crew bases.

 

[Jerry]

I know people feel KLM should transfer LBA over to mainline, and I’m sure the LBA management will be in conversation with KLM

I suppose the frustration there is that it LBA was scheduled to go mainline and it didn't happen but at least LBA still has the full 3 daily departures.

 

[Seasider]

It was not due to go over to mainline, but the inbound/outbound morning service, was due to be operated by mainline. That did not happen because of covid which has killed off a lot of business travel so I believe that we should be grateful we still have a 3 daily service, even if it is not as good as previously.

 

[lbaspotter]

oh I really want to say something, but I really can’t.

Feel sorry for eastern crews as it’s not their fault. Who in there right mind sends an over booked E170 into LBA yesterday whilst the E190 went to Newcastle to operate a football charter to Luton.

You reallly couldn’t make this s—t up.

 

[Aviador]

oh I really want to say something, but I really can’t.

Feel sorry for eastern crews as it’s not their fault. Who in there right mind sends an over booked E170 into LBA yesterday whilst the E190 went to Newcastle to operate a football charter to Luton.

You reallly couldn’t make this s—t up.

A private charter will be more lucrative for them but they should be considering the contractual service agreement with KLM. Surely KLM would not be happy. Anyway let's see what happens.

 

[pug]

A private charter will be more lucrative for them but they should be considering the contractual service agreement with KLM. Surely KLM would not be happy. Anyway let's see what happens.

It’s been suggested elsewhere that KLM are aware of the companies other obligations. Let’s not forget that they’ll be contracted to operate the football charters too. The question will be how long are KLM prepared to suffer from network disruption caused by an inability to build resilience into the operation?

As for the crew, let’s be real here the KLM contract goes they go with it. But I don’t see a favourable outcome for their feeder network if it happens, least not at the moment. Last I heard KLM are applying lots of pressure to take over the NWI operation too….

 

[BCFC]

oh I really want to say something, but I really can’t.

Feel sorry for eastern crews as it’s not their fault. Who in there right mind sends an over booked E170 into LBA yesterday whilst the E190 went to Newcastle to operate a football charter to Luton.

You reallly couldn’t make this s—t up.

Far easier just to fly from MAN for any long-haul.