Kuwait Airways

[TheLocalYokel]

My like signifies your approval of EGCC's post, not your claim to clumsiness in the setting down of your own thoughts. That notion is not true at all as I know full well from reading your posts.

 

[Yawner]

A seemingly well informed post has appeared on the Stansted forum on Pprune explaining the issues KU has faced with their JFK flights and the rationale behind their initial plan to change the routing to MAN and subsequently STN.

Makes a lot more sense than the wild, agenda driven conspiracy theories touted on here.

 

[EGCC_MAN]

The posting which you reference outlines the security considerations well but it does not introduce any surprises. We already knew that re-screening to satisfy US requirements was the reason that the westbound en route stop was needed. Neither MAN nor STN can provide a same-airport non-stop repatriation flight to KWI, so a secure road journey for individuals who fail screening is required in either case (although MAN could also offer the LHR Shuttle as an alternative). STN-LHR should present a shorter journey time by road but on that route a delay-free trip cannot be guaranteed either. Any perceived risk presented by these transfers applies in both cases. MAN and STN are equally capable of hosting the procedures required ... in fact, MAN is already experienced in providing a re-screening service to PIA. At the time of day required by Kuwait Airways apron congestion is not an issue at either airport.

Meanwhile, a friendly request (as you are listed as a 'New Member'). This site is positive, informative and constructively-moderated. It disseminates and encourages more thorough discussion of MAN news than any other site I have so far come across online. Respectful MAN-related exchanges concerning all aspects of the airport operation are (in my experience) welcomed on this site, be it air service news or topics such as surface access, construction, social media, statistics or traveller experience. That's the way it should be IMO. Let's leave provocative bitchy comments and trolling to that other forum where it has become sadly endemic. It used to be the best, but it isn't now. Welcome to F4A.

 

[User001]

Well, things have settled down at home enabling me to post a bit more freely again (and for any commentators out there, I never said my withdrawal was permanent). Anyway, time to catch up with some posts.

To answer some queries about STN vs MAN for KU, and the reasons for what's going on.

1) SNN is voluntarily downgrading it's fire cover, from Cat 9 to Cat 7, which means aircraft such as the B77W cannot be handled so readily. This has caused Kuwait to look elsewhere, and MAN for the bill for a multitude of reasons already discussed.

2) During the discussions, STN was put on the table, more as a vanity project for STN. As this flight doesn't have 5th freedoms, it was deemed no detriment to MAN to have the flight route via STN instead, and in return STN finally got a legacy carrier on the ground.

3) there have been snippets that any 'denied pax' or 'new crew' can get from STN to LHR VV better than MAN, when in fact, it could be argued the same situation could be handled better via MAN. What I mean by that is:

-any pax on the flight that fail the screening at MAN would be better put on the LHR shuttle than via a STN-LHR minibus. The reason being that the 'failed' pax can be held securely airside, flown on a secure shuttle, held securely airside at LHR and then put on the KU flight home. The minibus from STN to LHR isn't as secure. The U.K. Border Has to accept the pax walk the bad to the veichle, insecure bus ride and then walk the pax to check in. Not as great is it.

-one could argue a crew needed at MAN could fly LHR-MAN much faster than ground transport to STN. Despite both being London airports, they are not exactly close, and they don't call the M25 'the UKs largest car park' for nothing.

4) The problem with STN is that, as far as I'm aware, it isn't set up to handle this sort of operation, there isn't much need for a transfer facility at STN given it has no need for it based on current carriers, and such, the situation may not quite be as clear cut. Watch this space.

But anyway, I'm back!

 

[Dobbo]

Good to see you, lots to catch up on - so get cracking!!!!

 

[Aceshigh]

Great to have you back User.

And totally agree re your comment reference a vanity project for STN.

That really is well put and totally sums up the situation for me.

I suggested exactly the same myself.

Totally baffled as to how it could be more cost effective or simpler bussing pax around from STN. If this was put forward as the rationale I suggest it remains a smoke screen.

If as you say it's froth to "up the image" of Stansted that is not good enough.
If I was KOT I would be fuming.

I well understand the possibility of an economic argument but in this particular case see the justification "flaky" at best.

Manchester like Arsenal Venger is never far away from a "trip". 3 wins and all is well, one draw and suddenly we get the jitters.

Maybe I'm so old I have seen it all before.

We have had a tsunami of great news but you always get the feeling the growth has a level of fragility.

Manchester has to try 10 times harder than say Heathrow. As the capital it can soak up numerous loss makers and still sell it's service as prestigous? Manchester does not have that luxury and as such simply cannot afford to miss any opportunity. Especially one handed to us so readily.

A tech stop is not a terminator I get that but it "could" have been a relatively easy switch to swap a couple of those Westbound into a pax service plus cargo at little cost. Introducing a stand alone terminator is, as been said problematic.

My view remains that the opportunity was squandered and given to another airport on a plate.

My frustration station re Kuwait remains.

 

[ethanegcc]

Superb to have you and your insight back here! To be fair though, most of our discussion was still based off of snippets that you posted on other forums

Anyway, those are extremely good viewpoints and they make good sense. Might the last line imply it could still come to MAN?

 

[User001]

Aces high,

The transit flight, as it stands, can only be a transit flight for the time being. Due to a legal issue, the flight is not allowed to have 5th freedoms at this time, and this cannot sell seats on any sector other than KWI-JFK-KWI.

 

[Land23R]

Welcome back User001. On KU and the possibility of our own direct service, I could have sworn I read somewhere that it might start 2 x weekly from 1 October but can't just recall where. Was that rumour, speculation or perhaps something stronger, do you know? Or was it just my imagination?

 

[User001]

It's just a rumour at the moment, but is fuelled by local Kuwaiti press stating Manchester and Madrid will be starting this year.

I have done some enquiries and October seems to be the date suggested, but let's just wait and see what April brings first.

 

[Aceshigh]

"The transit flight, as it stands, can only be a transit flight for the time being."

Appreciate that but could they not pick up 5th freedom rights using the the ones they had ex LHR.

I know they sold the slots but assume they still hold rights?

 

[User001]

No, they had those revoked.

 

[User001]

Ok so can post now, the KU transit flight is coming to MAN after all.

KU117 a1415 d1630 daily B77W from 21st.

 

[ethanegcc]

Also reported on the AlphaFive page. Great news for spotters!

 

[Borneobob]

Can't wait to see this flying over my garden every afternoon.

 

[Dobbo]

Ok so can post now, the KU transit flight is coming to MAN after all.

KU117 a1415 d1630 daily B77W from 21st.

Coming back to this, Ian F seemed to be on top of the news of the switch to STN - so I'm surprised you managed to break the story (despite your extensive knowledge/contacts).

Either way, this is a good news day.

 

[User001]

I know, funny how Mr F jumps on a bad news story quicker than anyone here, but good news, well, no where to be seen. A bit like when his alter ego pseudonym on pprune used to post the MAN stats as quick as a flash when they were going down, but now we are in positive figures, again, no where to be seen.

I'm all for people posting on these threads, the more, the merrier. It's just a shame certain posters don't like to balance their news out a little.

 

[IanFarquharson]

Great news KU going to MAN after all.

I am all for airlines going to the regions rather than LHR.

See I am a 'balanced' poster.

 

[User001]

Balanced when prompted maybe.

Like I say, welcome to post, but looking back on a lot of your posts that involve MAN, even you must admit they have a largely negative slant and you must have realised it was only a matter of time before someone said something?

Given most news now comes from popular sources, I'm sure you could be just as quick with the good news as the bad, that's all.

#justsaying

 

[jfy1999]

As a BHX supporter who pops up to the Runway Visitor Park a couple of times each year I'm well chuffed with this. Love the new Kuwait livery. Spotter-friendly flight times too