However and ive been thinking about this, we have been crying out for a few years now for some Ryanair expansion and if MAD is another new route Ex BHX, then ryanair are really starting to move. This is what we have been asking for ???????
Ryanair
- Thread starter Aviador
- Start date
- Tagged users None
- Moderator
- #142
I have no problem with Ryanair starting Madrid, if they are committed to the route. I think we've all said that BHX is not a charity and if IBX cannot cope with the competition then so be it. What I would have a problem with is Ryanair opening the route, seeing off the competition, then pulling out themselves leaving us with nothing again. They seem to have a history of doing this.
Hopefully Iberia will have expected this and have done their home work. As said it's two different markets so hopefully they can coexist.
Hopefully Iberia will have expected this and have done their home work. As said it's two different markets so hopefully they can coexist.
nwoody2001
Well-Known Member
- Dec 1, 2014
- 1,926
- 133
facts I would like to stress with regard to the potential of RYR launching MAD.
- As said above, we have been willing RYR o grow for years, we no cant complain once that RYR potential do as we've asked.
- Competition is a good thing. If RYR launch MAD, that would give 3 airlines and 10x weekly flights. Compared to many other destinations, that really isn't something which BHX shouldn't be able to hand. s many have said, BCN manages 4x airlines and 22x weekly flights.
- the days of RYR aggressively killing off the competition have largely gone. 2014 saw RYR issues their first Profit Warning and have profits drop. The smaller airlines they fought off in the past have gone. I the case of BHX-MAD, RYR would be up against another top 3 euro loco and IBX, part of the monster IAG. RYR wont get everything their way.
- Lets just have faith that airlines know what they are doing and have done their homework!
- As said above, we have been willing RYR o grow for years, we no cant complain once that RYR potential do as we've asked.
- Competition is a good thing. If RYR launch MAD, that would give 3 airlines and 10x weekly flights. Compared to many other destinations, that really isn't something which BHX shouldn't be able to hand. s many have said, BCN manages 4x airlines and 22x weekly flights.
- the days of RYR aggressively killing off the competition have largely gone. 2014 saw RYR issues their first Profit Warning and have profits drop. The smaller airlines they fought off in the past have gone. I the case of BHX-MAD, RYR would be up against another top 3 euro loco and IBX, part of the monster IAG. RYR wont get everything their way.
- Lets just have faith that airlines know what they are doing and have done their homework!
User001
New Member
- Jul 16, 2015
- 0
- 0
I know I will be seen as the damp cloth for this, but, 3 carriers will not be sustained in the long term.
Glasgow had the issue of multiple carrier on Madrid and now has none, Stansted the same and Manchester the same.
Manchester is probably the most infamous if the 'Mardid syndrome' as its now affectionately called. There have been 3 times in recent history that MAN-MAD had 3 carriers, and all 3 times it failed. The issue is that carriers price each other out. Iberia believe it or not are usually the first to blink, but, I fear at 2 weekly, Norwegian may be the losers in the BHX battle.
As said, 3 or more carriers has failed at multiple airports at lots of points in the past, I fail to see how BHX will be the special case in this instance. The battle won't be noticed at first, but, if BHX has the 3 current carriers serving MAD in 2 years time, I'd be surprised, very very surprised.
2 carriers can compliment each other on 'thinner' routes, but, any more, and it collapses.
MAN-VIE has just done it again to prove the point. Had 3 carriers on the route, and Jet2 blinked and pulled out.
As said, BHX is not a special case, the fact it took so long to get a Madrid route shows it's not a high volume route crying out for bulk capacity. Let's not forget as well, it's not a simple case of 10 weekly evenly spread flights offering a full daily service, they are 10 flights that compete on the same days as each other except Thursday with Just Norwegian and no flights Tue/Sat.
Unpopular viewpoint, I know, but, sometimes the rosebud hides the thorns.
Glasgow had the issue of multiple carrier on Madrid and now has none, Stansted the same and Manchester the same.
Manchester is probably the most infamous if the 'Mardid syndrome' as its now affectionately called. There have been 3 times in recent history that MAN-MAD had 3 carriers, and all 3 times it failed. The issue is that carriers price each other out. Iberia believe it or not are usually the first to blink, but, I fear at 2 weekly, Norwegian may be the losers in the BHX battle.
As said, 3 or more carriers has failed at multiple airports at lots of points in the past, I fail to see how BHX will be the special case in this instance. The battle won't be noticed at first, but, if BHX has the 3 current carriers serving MAD in 2 years time, I'd be surprised, very very surprised.
2 carriers can compliment each other on 'thinner' routes, but, any more, and it collapses.
MAN-VIE has just done it again to prove the point. Had 3 carriers on the route, and Jet2 blinked and pulled out.
As said, BHX is not a special case, the fact it took so long to get a Madrid route shows it's not a high volume route crying out for bulk capacity. Let's not forget as well, it's not a simple case of 10 weekly evenly spread flights offering a full daily service, they are 10 flights that compete on the same days as each other except Thursday with Just Norwegian and no flights Tue/Sat.
Unpopular viewpoint, I know, but, sometimes the rosebud hides the thorns.
richard winterbourn
Active Member
- Aug 19, 2015
- 423
- 93
As much as it is about airlines choosing a route, it is also about passengers choosing an airline....
I think it is about equal measure those who fly Ryanair and those who say 'never'. Maybe the latter group includes many who have long memories, of days when the airline could appear quite brutal in upholding its T&Cs.
By comparison, its quite friendly now (in my opinion), but it might still take a long time to shift the opinion of others.
Thus, i think IBX, and with its onward connections, will stand its ground without too much trouble
I think it is about equal measure those who fly Ryanair and those who say 'never'. Maybe the latter group includes many who have long memories, of days when the airline could appear quite brutal in upholding its T&Cs.
By comparison, its quite friendly now (in my opinion), but it might still take a long time to shift the opinion of others.
Thus, i think IBX, and with its onward connections, will stand its ground without too much trouble
Jon Dempsey
Well-Known Member
Good point Richard, but I don't think too many non-business travellers would give a monkey's about the carrier to Barajas, so long as they had time to meet their connection.
Personal opinion, that's all.
Personal opinion, that's all.
Daza
Active Member
- Aug 13, 2015
- 162
- 43
nwoody2001
Well-Known Member
- Dec 1, 2014
- 1,926
- 133
Ryanair adds Madrid and Verona routes to Birmingham schedule
5th November 2015
The Irish airline is also set to launch new routes to Madrid and Verona in addition to those to Corfu and Vilnius
Budget airline Ryanair has added a further two routes to its expanding schedule at Birmingham Airport.
The Irish airline is also set to launch new routes to Madrid and Verona for summer 2016, in addition to those recently announced to Corfu and Vilnius.
Growth plans at Birmingham also include additional flights to Alicante, Barcelona, Dublin, Malaga, Malta and Palma.
In all the Dublin-based budget airline is introducing 23 new routes from Birmingham in its summer 2016 schedule in a move that is expected to see its passenger numbers at Birmingham soar to 1.75 million each year.
Ryanair sales and marketing executive Lisa Buckley said: “Ryanair is pleased to announce further expansion to our Birmingham summer 2016 schedule with two new routes to Madrid and Verona, alongside new routes to Corfu and Vilnius, which will deliver 1.75 million customers per annum and support 1,300 on-site jobs at Birmingham Airport.
“UK customers can look forward to further improvements, including our new personalised website and real customer destination reviews, improved menus, new cabin crew uniforms and new cabin interiors on board, with more to come, as we continue to offer so much more than just lowest fares.”
Ryanair’s policy of paying more attention to customer service has been highlighted as a key factor behind growth plans which are set to see a 25 per cent increase in operations at Birmingham Airport.
The airline’s head of sales and marketing, Carol Anne O’Neill, recently told the Post the airline’s growth at Birmingham, which outstrips its wider growth forecast, could at least in part be directly attributed to its ‘Always Getting Better’ programme.
Introduced last year, the initiative saw a radical new approach to customer service and new bases, a new personalised website, a new app, new cabin interiors, new crew uniforms and improved inflight menus.
Crucially it also offers allocated seating and the opportunity for passengers to have a second carry-on bag.
Ms O’Neill said: “We did need to up our game in terms of the customer experience and we are seeing more passengers travelling with us because the customer experience is now a much better one.
“Michael O’Leary has been quoted as saying if he knew that being nice to customers would make him more money he would have started being nicer a long time ago. We have had a fantastic year.”
Ryanair has enjoyed a resurgence. Following two profit warnings in 2013, in September this year the airline increased its full-year profit forecast to between €1.18 billion and €1.21 billion.
http://www.birminghampost.co.uk/busines ... s-10388639
5th November 2015
The Irish airline is also set to launch new routes to Madrid and Verona in addition to those to Corfu and Vilnius
Budget airline Ryanair has added a further two routes to its expanding schedule at Birmingham Airport.
The Irish airline is also set to launch new routes to Madrid and Verona for summer 2016, in addition to those recently announced to Corfu and Vilnius.
Growth plans at Birmingham also include additional flights to Alicante, Barcelona, Dublin, Malaga, Malta and Palma.
In all the Dublin-based budget airline is introducing 23 new routes from Birmingham in its summer 2016 schedule in a move that is expected to see its passenger numbers at Birmingham soar to 1.75 million each year.
Ryanair sales and marketing executive Lisa Buckley said: “Ryanair is pleased to announce further expansion to our Birmingham summer 2016 schedule with two new routes to Madrid and Verona, alongside new routes to Corfu and Vilnius, which will deliver 1.75 million customers per annum and support 1,300 on-site jobs at Birmingham Airport.
“UK customers can look forward to further improvements, including our new personalised website and real customer destination reviews, improved menus, new cabin crew uniforms and new cabin interiors on board, with more to come, as we continue to offer so much more than just lowest fares.”
Ryanair’s policy of paying more attention to customer service has been highlighted as a key factor behind growth plans which are set to see a 25 per cent increase in operations at Birmingham Airport.
The airline’s head of sales and marketing, Carol Anne O’Neill, recently told the Post the airline’s growth at Birmingham, which outstrips its wider growth forecast, could at least in part be directly attributed to its ‘Always Getting Better’ programme.
Introduced last year, the initiative saw a radical new approach to customer service and new bases, a new personalised website, a new app, new cabin interiors, new crew uniforms and improved inflight menus.
Crucially it also offers allocated seating and the opportunity for passengers to have a second carry-on bag.
Ms O’Neill said: “We did need to up our game in terms of the customer experience and we are seeing more passengers travelling with us because the customer experience is now a much better one.
“Michael O’Leary has been quoted as saying if he knew that being nice to customers would make him more money he would have started being nicer a long time ago. We have had a fantastic year.”
Ryanair has enjoyed a resurgence. Following two profit warnings in 2013, in September this year the airline increased its full-year profit forecast to between €1.18 billion and €1.21 billion.
http://www.birminghampost.co.uk/busines ... s-10388639
- Moderator
- #150
Well of all the potential unserved routes there are out there they start Madrid. I don't think there is room for three on this one. I hope to be proved wrong but I really don't want a situation where we end up with nothing.
nwoody2001
Well-Known Member
- Dec 1, 2014
- 1,926
- 133
I really cant see the situation of Madrid being unserved from BHX for a while now!
Times have changed and the times of airlines throwing money at routes that don't make money are over. Consequently, you have to ask the logical question:
"if money wasn't to be made on a route in 215, why would an airline fight for it?"
Why would RYR want to go to the effort of throwing money and recourse at a route to kill off the competition only to then withdraw it themselves? The answer to that question in 2015 is very different to the answer we would have had in 2005.
This is not as simple as like for like airlines completeing, all have different offers!
Ryanair - Cost
Norwegian - Service
Iberia - onward connections
As such, I hope the markets they are targeting would be very different, and at the end of the day 10x weekly flights to the largest Spanish city in summer peak really should be something BHX should be able to sustain if it is to grow towards and beyond the 12m pax!
Times have changed and the times of airlines throwing money at routes that don't make money are over. Consequently, you have to ask the logical question:
"if money wasn't to be made on a route in 215, why would an airline fight for it?"
Why would RYR want to go to the effort of throwing money and recourse at a route to kill off the competition only to then withdraw it themselves? The answer to that question in 2015 is very different to the answer we would have had in 2005.
This is not as simple as like for like airlines completeing, all have different offers!
Ryanair - Cost
Norwegian - Service
Iberia - onward connections
As such, I hope the markets they are targeting would be very different, and at the end of the day 10x weekly flights to the largest Spanish city in summer peak really should be something BHX should be able to sustain if it is to grow towards and beyond the 12m pax!
Perhaps Ryanair feel they have more to lose by allowing Norwegian to gain a stronger foothold at BHX. They pull this trick all the time all over Europe. Another one they like to do is take a minor airport, eg, Maribor, Slovenia, start the service, then request 1m euro from the city council in order to subsidise it, then withdraw the route if they refuse. This happened about 8 years ago.
nwoody2001
Well-Known Member
- Dec 1, 2014
- 1,926
- 133
Im sure RYR have more to lose by allowing Norwegian to gain a stronger foothold at BHX, but that's for Norwegian to respond to. All the routes Norwegian currently serve from the airport, they are now all in direct competition with other airlines and have the lowest frequency, and as such, if DY want to battle and win the battle, they will need to pull their figure out!!!
- Moderator
- #155
Personally I think they're after Iberia. I don't think it will be the first time and it seems to have come just a little too soon after their announcement.
I take the point about 10 weekly flights and on the face of it you would think that it's an amount that BHX should be able to handle, although three on a Sunday is a lot. Historically though all but the most high density of routes have struggled with three or more operators. The fares often end up as a race to the bottom and the yields totally collapse. This is not just at BHX either.
The one saving grace we have is with oil prices so low you would hope that the break even point is lower now than it has been for several years. Who knows maybe Norwegian will sit back and watch Ryanair and Iberia destroy each other and end up with the route all to themselves again
It'll be an interesting one to watch.
I take the point about 10 weekly flights and on the face of it you would think that it's an amount that BHX should be able to handle, although three on a Sunday is a lot. Historically though all but the most high density of routes have struggled with three or more operators. The fares often end up as a race to the bottom and the yields totally collapse. This is not just at BHX either.
The one saving grace we have is with oil prices so low you would hope that the break even point is lower now than it has been for several years. Who knows maybe Norwegian will sit back and watch Ryanair and Iberia destroy each other and end up with the route all to themselves again
It'll be an interesting one to watch.
Daza
Active Member
- Aug 13, 2015
- 162
- 43
nwoody2001 wrote
I'm suspicious as FR have shown very little interest in BHX for many years retreating to just serving Eastern European and Sun routes. Am I correct in thinking they have served MAD before?
Daza
I hope you are right and only time will tell. :s_crazy
I'm suspicious as FR have shown very little interest in BHX for many years retreating to just serving Eastern European and Sun routes. Am I correct in thinking they have served MAD before?
Daza
Bhx_fifteen
Active Member
- May 6, 2015
- 137
- 63
The official article says that S16 will see 118 flights per week with FR from BHX...Does anyone know how many flights per week operated for S15? Or how many will operate this Winter?
This growth must now exceed 25% as they estimated when they first released BHX S16!
This growth must now exceed 25% as they estimated when they first released BHX S16!
Madrid is a funny one. People tend to head for the Spanish coasts for sun sea and sand rather than landlocked places such as Madrid. Yet it does connect BHX passengers with a superb hub for South America and other places too - plus hopefully it'll make a good business route in itself.
- Moderator
- #159
Has anyone been to Madrid?
I've never visited myself, I have been to Barcelona though so I'd be interested to hear how Madrid compares as a city break destination?
I've never visited myself, I have been to Barcelona though so I'd be interested to hear how Madrid compares as a city break destination?
User001
New Member
- Jul 16, 2015
- 0
- 0
I've been to Madrid. It's a lovely city but I personally wouldn't spend more than 2-3 nights. There is the royal palace, the main park, museums and some nice squares to eat, but, for me personally, there wasn't a huge amount to do.
Barcelona is the main draw and has many things to do, which is why it gets so many more visitors.
Barcelona is the main draw and has many things to do, which is why it gets so many more visitors.
Remove Advertisements
Subscribe to help support your favourite forum and in return we'll remove all our advertisements. Your contribution will help to pay for things like site maintenance, domain name renewals and annual server charges.
NEW - Profile Posts
If anyone would like to share their local airport news right here in our news area let me know so I can give you the correct permissions to do so. It only takes a couple of minutes to upload a news story with an accompanying image. The news items can then be shared on the site homepage by you. #TakePart #Forums4airports Bring the news to one place!
Well it looks like I'm off to Australia and New Zealand next year! Booked with BA from Manchester via Heathrow with a stop in Singapore and returning with Air New Zealand and BA via LAX to Heathrow. Will circumnavigate the globe and be my first trans-Pacific flight. First long haul flight with BA as well and of course Air NZ.
Trending Hashtags
-
#liverpoolairportWeight: 3
-
#Jet2Weight: 2
-
#LiverpoolJohnLennonWeight: 2
-
#GetUKDomesticFlightsMovingWeight: 1
-
#EasyJetWeight: 1
-
#LBAreviewWeight: 1