Thomas Cook

[Jerry]

Haha!

Slight tangent, do we see TCX / Condor persisting with the A332 long term?

I'm not expecting an order of B787 or A350, but there must be a long term fleet plan for the long haul fleet.

A330 900

It is interesting that the state of Colorado is apparently offering an incentive to (it is presumed Norwegian) to start DEN-CDG.

Manchester/Northern England is not Paris, but good for thought for TCX...

I'm sure i read somewhere that for it's size Denver is one of the most under served US cities on long haul for it's population size. The state of Colorado has a population of 5 million. Denver only has international routes to LHR and LGW in the future so it could be a good future option for TCX.

 

[Jerry]

Haha!

Slight tangent, do we see TCX / Condor persisting with the A332 long term?

I'm not expecting an order of B787 or A350, but there must be a long term fleet plan for the long haul fleet.

A330 900

It is interesting that the state of Colorado is apparently offering an incentive to (it is presumed Norwegian) to start DEN-CDG.

Manchester/Northern England is not Paris, but good for thought for TCX...

I'm sure i read somewhere that for it's size Denver is one of the most under served US cities on long haul for it's population size. The state of Colorado has a population of 5 million. Denver only has international routes to LHR and LGW in the future so it could be a good future option for TCX.

 

[User001]

Mon: JFK/HOG/BOS/LAX/MCO/PUJ/LAS/1xspare
Tue: JFK/CUN/LAS/MCO/4xspare
Wed: JFK/CCC/CUN/LAX/MCO/BOS/2xspare
Thu: JFK/SEA/HOG/CUN/LAS/MCO/SFO/PUJ *full*
Fri: JFK/MIA/VRA/CUN/BOS/MCO/PUJ/1xspare
Sat: JFK/SNU/CUN/BOS/LAS/LAX/MCO/MCO *full*
Sun: JFK/MIA/SEA/CUN/LAS/MCO/MCO/SFO *full*

I've updated the list as Boston now has a 4th weekly flight added on Wednesdays. For June, BOS is 5 weekly as it operates Mon/Tue/Wed/Fri/Sat.

MCO changes as the 2nd daily on Tue has been removed, but a 2nd now operates on Saturday.

Las Vegas goes 5 weekly with a Monday flight added.

Miami remains in the timetable even after this latest update.

This does mean 8 A330 required on Thu/Sat/Sun.

As ever, more changes expected, but I'll do a proper check tonight to make sure I've got everything in the right place.

 

[Comet]

User BOS only seems to be 3pw. First flight on 28 May. Then 4 pw for first week of June then rest of June and July 3 pw then 2pw in August

 

[Dobbo]

Does look like they intent to put VS under pressure MAN-BOS. In light of the recent positive signs from the US market (SQ, AA trying the 787 and TCX) I wonder how the DL/VS JV is going on...

 

[User001]

User BOS only seems to be 3pw. First flight on 28 May. Then 4 pw for first week of June then rest of June and July 3 pw then 2pw in August

The flights will be put on sale soon. They have made the timetable but these extras, Miami and at least one more new route will be bookable by Autumn.

For example, here is MAN-BOS in June:

 

[Comet]

OK. Have to wait and see what else turns up.

 

[User001]

Mon: HOG/PUJ/BOS/LAS/LAX/JFK/MCO/1 spare
Tue: CUN/LAS/JFK/MCO/ 4 spare
Wed: CCC/CUN/BOS/LAX/JFK/MCO/ 2 spare
Thu: HOG/PUJ/CUN/LAS/JFK/MCO/SFO/SEA/ full
Fri: VRA/PUJ/CUN/BOS/MIA/JFK/MCO/ 1 spare
Sat: SNU/CUN/BOS/LAS/LAX/JFK/MCO/MCO/ full
Sun: CUN/LAS/MIA/JFK/MCO/MCO/SFO/SEA/ full

This is the fully updated list thus far. I expect Tue will see a few short haul flights.

 

[ethanegcc]

So let's say a two-weekly Tampa route could run Tue and Fri and a one-weekly New Orleans could run Wednesday?

Anyway, some Thomas Cook aircraft will operate their own A330 on selected dates from Seattle. One hopes the scheduled are altered so that all Seattle routes are operated with their own aircraft.

 

[User001]

Well, playing devils advocate...

Tampa could run Mon/Wed.
San Diego could run Tue/Fri

Then increase MCO so that it runs 2 daily on Tue as well as Sat/Sun, the. this would give 'central Florida MCO/TPA' double daily Mon/Tue/Wed/Sat/Sun, and really compete with the near double daily VS to MCO.

Then have the last 2 spare Tue and 1 wed slot for any short haul that may need a little boost.

I don't think having just 1 weekly on MSY would work, and to give SAN/TPA a decent schedule, being 2 weekly on Tue/Wed would be a rather daft schedule to be honest.

 

[ethanegcc]

View attachment 5632
Seattle being advertised very prominently 🙂

 

[User001]

Was having a think last night,mor where I think TCX could head in the next few years, so, here is my idea of what TCX:2025 US/Canada could look like (all things being well). This is just a SUMMER only schedule.

1/2 JFK: double daily A330 with J class
3/4 BOS: daily A330 no J class
5/6 MCO: 11 weekly A330 J class AM no J class PM
6 TPA: 3 weekly A330 no J class
7 MIA: 3 weekly A330 J class
7 BNA: 2 weekly A330 no J class
10 BWI: 3 weekly A330 no J class
8/9 LAS: 9 weekly A330 J class
7 PHX: 2 weekly A330 no J class
4 LAX: daily A330 J class
10 SAN: 2 weekly A330 no J class
11 SEA: 3 weekly A330 J class
12 SFO: 4 weekly A330 J class
11 DEN: 2 weekly A330 J class
11 MSY: 2 weekly A33@ J class

The flights would need 13 based A330, this is based on 12 for the above schedule (which does have gaps) and then 1 more for the Caribbean programme (the full programme can fit into the 1 A330 and the gaps from the 12 other based aircraft).
One could say that it may be beneficial to have a back up A330 to minimise the sorts of issues they have had this summer with leased in aircraft and delays, but, it's not nessesary required to run the above schedule.

Could be a great little network!

 

[Jerry]

TCX would be well received at Nashville as it doesn't have any direct European flights. St Louis Missouri is another. Could be a few middle America destinations which don't have direct European flights which could work 2 or 3 weekly frequencies.

 

[Dobbo]

Any chance of a winter network plan or east/south routes?

I'd have presumed DEN would be winter for example (unless I've missed something).

 

[ethanegcc]

Very exciting and ambitious. But focusing on this year for now and hoping we can secure at least two more new routes!

 

[User001]

I'll work on a winter plan later on.

Some variables to throw into this are:

-China. TCX has made no secret that they hold the licences to serve China, so, if they are as serious as they make out, then one would expect some focus shifted away from the USA?

-St Louis would indeed be a good route to have on the boards, but I imagine there would be next to nothing O&D wise like the others have. New Orleans and Nashville for example have the Deep South tourist trail (music, history etc), Phoenix has the alternative entry to the Grand Canyon area as well as a little bit of business that would be more suited to PE/lower end J class and Tampa is, well, Tampa. A huge draw for Brits.
Therefore, I just don't see St.Louis being of that much value to TCX. I'd probably expect MSP ala Condor before STL, as it looks like TCX may be heading towards Condor routes for TCX (they may be looking at MAN-XXX-MSY etc on TCX/DE codeshares to see where the largest passenger flows are.

I used to be sceptical that MAN would ever get a SEA route, but looking at many comments since it was announced, it see,s like it was actually a no brainer route!

 

[Land23R]

TCX

Nice list User001. with some interesting routes. If they were all morning flights, it might be a bit of a struggle for USPC if they were confined to one pier though - unless they had seen off all the competition in the meantime, ha ha.👍

 

[User001]

Not all flights would be morning,

I envisage a second JFK at about 5pm, and the BOS at about 3:30pm to rotate in with the daily JFK. Of course pre clearance may be closed by about 3-4pm like Dublin, so, the second JFK flight probably wouldn't be pre cleared anyway.

Other flights could be spread out across the day from 10am until 3pm so gate utilisation could be managed with aircraft arriving at a normal gate and then towed over to USPC before departure. Dublin's facility is probably about the same size of the proposed MAN one gate wise, and they seem to manage it no problem at all.

 

[Land23R]

Yes, I'm sure you are right. It was a bit tongue in cheek on my part.

How does DUB work exactly? Do pax check in in the normal way with hold bags, get a boarding card if not checked in online and then go to Pre-Clearance? Or do cases have to be taken with them to USPC for x-ray and customs clearance? I'm trying to envisage how much space the facility might take up in a pier, and would the pier be limited to US flights only while USPC was open?

 

[ethanegcc]

The press release about the SEA route clearly stated from Christopher Debus that the Seattle market had been a great success for Condor, so maybe that is the new way of thinking. Success for Condor, success for Thomas Cook. That leads me to believe that MSP/PIT/BWI/MSY could be prime candidates and, in addition, new ventures like TPA.