Cardiff Airport - General Thread

Jerry

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This is what i could find with reference to Cardiff Airport in Labour's manifesto.

"Build a sustainable future for our key ports and Cardiff Airport."
UKIP has released their manifesto and the section related to Cardiff Airport states this.

"We do not believe that government should own or operate airports, as this breeds inefficiency and stymies competition. We opposed the Welsh
Government’s decision to squander £52m of Welsh taxpayers’ money on buying Cardiff airport and then providing them with a further £28m in
loans after the airport posted losses of £18.5m in 2019.
UKIP pledges to:
Sell Cardiff Airport immediately to mitigate any further loss to Welsh taxpayers so a new owner can operate it on a proper commercial basis.
Oppose the devolution of Air Passenger Duty.
 

Nuffsaid

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Neil Hamilton is working on behalf of the English including Nigel Farage. Ukip are a real nasty racist bunch who are hell bent on keeping Wales subservient to English control.
 

TheLocalYokel

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Yes
Neil Hamilton is working on behalf of the English including Nigel Farage. Ukip are a real nasty racist bunch who are hell bent on keeping Wales subservient to English control.
I would not agree that he is working on behalf of 'the English' in the sense that it is in support of the views of the man and woman in the street in England. I have no empathy with UKIP, Hamilton or Farage if they are as you describe.

I regard myself as English and am not wedded to the Union. If a majority of people in any of the home countries expresses the desire to leave then I believe they should be afforded the opportunity to put their wishes to the test in the form of a binding referendum.
 

Nuffsaid

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With regards to the English I refer to the establishment (not the person on the street) that is so desperate to keep the union together they are using fringe parties and disrupters to ensure this happens. Yes, it’s the actual establishment, the ones that are now in power at Westminster not the perceived one that Farage had all the Brexiteers thinking were out to get them. Still, Farages tactics worked and look where the U.K. is now, plenty of jobs on the line in Wales already.
 

TheLocalYokel

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Yes
With regards to the English I refer to the establishment (not the person on the street) that is so desperate to keep the union together they are using fringe parties and disrupters to ensure this happens. Yes, it’s the actual establishment, the ones that are now in power at Westminster not the perceived one that Farage had all the Brexiteers thinking were out to get them. Still, Farages tactics worked and look where the U.K. is now, plenty of jobs on the line in Wales already.
Many thanks for the clarification.
 

aviatorconcorde

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UKIP has released their manifesto and the section related to Cardiff Airport states this.

"We do not believe that government should own or operate airports, as this breeds inefficiency and stymies competition. We opposed the Welsh
Government’s decision to squander £52m of Welsh taxpayers’ money on buying Cardiff airport and then providing them with a further £28m in
loans after the airport posted losses of £18.5m in 2019.
UKIP pledges to:
Sell Cardiff Airport immediately to mitigate any further loss to Welsh taxpayers so a new owner can operate it on a proper commercial basis.
Oppose the devolution of Air Passenger Duty.
Well they’ve got a point. And no, that doesn’t mean i associate myself with UKIP at all.

Welsh government have mismanaged the airport since 2013, taking on more and more cash burn. The airport in its current form is going to carry on burning cash.
 

Nuffsaid

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Well they’ve got a point. And no, that doesn’t mean i associate myself with UKIP at all.

Welsh government have mismanaged the airport since 2013, taking on more and more cash burn. The airport in its current form is going to carry on burning cash.
What is your suggestion to the current ‘cash burning’ problem?
There is a difference between cash burning and investment and prior to this pandemic the investments were beginning to pay off. The loss of Thomas Cook and Flybe were no fault of the airport. Wizz has stepped in and hopefully will soon get off the ground. The airport now needs to reinstate its domestic flights along with those to Dublin and Paris. It will continue to ‘burn cash’ until a critical mass of passengers and revenue is achieved. Hopefully that happens and soon to prevent the likes of UKIP lobbying to have it sold and developed into a housing estate.
 

Jerry

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Well they’ve got a point. And no, that doesn’t mean i associate myself with UKIP at all.

Welsh government have mismanaged the airport since 2013, taking on more and more cash burn. The airport in its current form is going to carry on burning cash.
Well if we are too believe Carwyn Jones the alternative would've been closure or at least the continuation of little investment by the private owners. We're also assuming that those owners wouldn't have gotten cash from the Welsh government later on down the road.
The reality is that under private ownership there's always the risk that an owner might value the land space more for development than the actual airport business and personally I'm not sure any responsible Welsh government can risk that.
 

Jerry

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Well they’ve got a point. And no, that doesn’t mean i associate myself with UKIP at all.

Welsh government have mismanaged the airport since 2013, taking on more and more cash burn. The airport in its current form is going to carry on burning cash.
Had a look at the Conservatives manifesto and their only policy concerning Cardiff airport is to return it to private ownership. It also looks like that getting the UK government to devolve Air Passenger Duty didn't make the manifesto and as they are standing on a no more powers platform I suspect it's been dropped.
 

Jerry

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What's surprised me when looking through the manifestos for aviation related policies or commitments is how little aviation features.

In general the right wing parties want to sell Cardiff airport. Labour say they'll continue to support it. Lib Dems and Greens don't mention it. It's only Plaid that seems to set down anything specific.
Kind of hoped for a little bit more from the other parties!
 

geoff

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CWL has lost out again with EI Regional starting flights from Exeter to Dublin, CWL is seems is being completely ignored by the operators of the domestic routes.
 

Jerry

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CWL has lost out again with EI Regional starting flights from Exeter to Dublin, CWL is seems is being completely ignored by the operators of the domestic routes.
Makes you wonder what they've done to upset these airlines!
 

Foxlimayankee

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Makes you wonder what they've done to upset these airlines!
Airlines go where the money is. NQY and EXT are only 3 weekly and 4 weekly respectively. I would imagine this is down to holiday demand.
Its a shame the WG doesn't push Wales as a tourist destination with CWL as its access point. Improved train links to West Wales would be needed.
 

Jerry

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Airlines go where the money is. NQY and EXT are only 3 weekly and 4 weekly respectively. I would imagine this is down to holiday demand.
Its a shame the WG doesn't push Wales as a tourist destination with CWL as its access point. Improved train links to West Wales would be needed.
Yet I'm at a motorway services on the M4 and there's advertising advertising Wales as a holiday destination and I've seen other signs advertising Wales and Ireland. Celtic routes I think the campaign is called and surely considering the connections between Ireland and Wales there should be enough demand for 4 weekly ATR flights to Dublin from September onwards.
 

aviatorconcorde

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What is your suggestion to the current ‘cash burning’ problem?
There is a difference between cash burning and investment and prior to this pandemic the investments were beginning to pay off. The loss of Thomas Cook and Flybe were no fault of the airport. Wizz has stepped in and hopefully will soon get off the ground. The airport now needs to reinstate its domestic flights along with those to Dublin and Paris. It will continue to ‘burn cash’ until a critical mass of passengers and revenue is achieved. Hopefully that happens and soon to prevent the likes of UKIP lobbying to have it sold and developed into a housing estate.

it’s utterly unacceptable the amount of cash the airport is burning through. Over £150 million of tax payers cash gone. And it will continue.

ignore covid and it was losing money before. Welsh government incompetence as per usual mismanaging things.

I supported the airport over the years but it is now becoming beyond a joke for the tax payer. There comes a time when you need to draw the line.
 

Jerry

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I supported the airport over the years but it is now becoming beyond a joke for the tax payer. There comes a time when you need to draw the line.
With covid it's recovery will have to begin again. It was on track before but unfortunately has had a set back and gone back to square one because of things out of the airports control.

As for the Welsh government let's face it they are damned if they do and damned if they don't. If they didn't support the airport people like me would be up in arms about it and because they do other's like you are up in arms about it.
In the end they have chosen to support it once again because no doubt they see it as part of Wales transport infrastructure like the roads and the rails and government invests in things like that.
It's part of connecting Wales to the world which the airport itself will have the challenge of regaining a lot of that connectivity in the future.
I think people need to think of it as a very long term investment.
 

Foxlimayankee

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it’s utterly unacceptable the amount of cash the airport is burning through. Over £150 million of tax payers cash gone. And it will continue.

ignore covid and it was losing money before. Welsh government incompetence as per usual mismanaging things.

I supported the airport over the years but it is now becoming beyond a joke for the tax payer. There comes a time when you need to draw the line.
The WG aren't necessarily running the Airport. The Airport is being run as it was before, the WG just own it. You need to understand that and stop making it political.
The past decade of what has or hasn't happened at CWL has been discussed to death on this forum and I for one will not be covering ground again and again to explain that.
The WG buying the Airport was a long term investment with no doubt a view of selling it on again, but also a long term investment in the economy boost it provides to Wales.

Shall we shut the railways down as well? The whole UK rail network is losing millions since covid and will take time to recover.
As Jerry has said, if covid hadn't happened CWL would still be on the road to recovery.
 

aviatorconcorde

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The WG aren't necessarily running the Airport. The Airport is being run as it was before, the WG just own it. You need to understand that and stop making it political.
The past decade of what has or hasn't happened at CWL has been discussed to death on this forum and I for one will not be covering ground again and again to explain that.
The WG buying the Airport was a long term investment with no doubt a view of selling it on again, but also a long term investment in the economy boost it provides to Wales.

Shall we shut the railways down as well? The whole UK rail network is losing millions since covid and will take time to recover.
As Jerry has said, if covid hadn't happened CWL would still be on the road to recovery.
The airport is firmly under WG control...that was made clear in the inside the airport documentary.

Welsh government need to be held to account. Therefore it’s difficult not to make a discussion about an airport owned by a government political. Just because we are all aviation fans it doesn’t mean what is also a government entity should be allowed to go on wasting and wasting hundreds of millions of tax payers cash.

Welsh government don’t have a very good track record of successful projects and now Cardiff Airport is sadly being added to that list. I was very pleased initially (back in 2013?) that the airport was going to be purchased by the government but has now become a tax payer black hole with an anti business first minister at the helm.
 
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Nigel B

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Getting sick of WG bashing over the airport, Jerry is right the WG are helping to keep a asset that has had tremendous bad luck in recent years after a disastrous period of time under bad private ownership and management.
The conservative party would love CWL to fail under WG ownership, no surprises there!
 
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