Bristol Airport - General Thread

[kraktoa]

Winter fares on EZY to Gibraltar were quoted anecdotally by passengers this week as£30 each way. How long can airlines absorb these losses during their winter periods. With FR posting a loss recently the fear is that one of the big 2 locos at BRS will scale back and this could spell disaster for the airport. Troubling times ahead.

Only silver lining is that both locos are buying more aircraft.

 

[Jerry]

Winter fares on EZY to Gibraltar were quoted anecdotally by passengers this week as£30 each way. How long can airlines absorb these losses during their winter periods. With FR posting a loss recently the fear is that one of the big 2 locos at BRS will scale back and this could spell disaster for the airport. Troubling times ahead.

Only silver lining is that both locos are buying more aircraft.

Yet from what I've seen on many of the city routes Easyjet is very expensive so they could be making up any losses there and I don't think either would run a route at a loss for long. If GIB isn't profitable I'd imagine that they'd cut it.

 

[Kernow Bravo]

I came across the following Q&A regarding runway length requirements which may be of interest. Whilst I am not technically knowledgeable on such matters and clearly the reply was pitched in layman's terms, the data for the EWR cross runway in particular surprised me!

https://scandinaviantraveler.com/en/aviation/ask-the-pilot-how-long-does-a-runway-need-to-be

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I came across the following Q&A regarding runway length requirements which may be of interest. Whilst I am not technically knowledgeable on such matters and clearly the reply was pitched in layman's terms, the data for the EWR cross runway in particular surprised me!

https://scandinaviantraveler.com/en/aviation/ask-the-pilot-how-long-does-a-runway-need-to-be

Like you I don't profess to have any technical knowledge but my layman's surprise comes through when reading that the SAS pilot says his airline regularly operates their A330s and A340s from the 2,050 metre cross-runway at Newark (EWR) and on the 2,400 metre runway at Chicago O'Hare (ORD). A check reveals that both airports have other runways considerably longer than the ones mentioned. One would think that a fully-loaded A 330/340 taking off from those runways for, say, Stockholm would be quite heavy.

I understand that some airlines won't operate certain types of aircraft from some airports even though they could do so safely and without load penalty. Qatar for example could surely have operated to Doha from BRS with their 787-8 aircraft. TUI flies much farther with is own 787-8s from BRS.

The BRS runway overall length is said to be 2,011 metres but the take-off distance available (TODA) is less from either end.

Another consideration of course is the strengh of the runway, taxiway and apron, with airports given pavement classification numbers (PCNs).

It would be very illuminating to hear from any suitably qualified person regarding the operational capability of the BRS runway.

 

[kraktoa]

Blue Islands adds another 5000 seats this summer from Jersey to Bristol. News release today. 76 extra flights

 

[superking]

Will that be under Flybe flight numbers or Blue island. A bit of good news at last.

 

[Jerry]

Will that be under Flybe flight numbers or Blue island. A bit of good news at last.

Flybe

 

[TheLocalYokel]

BRS press release today.

https://www.bristolairport.co.uk/ab...tol-airport-wins-best-airport-in-europe-award

Well done to all those involved. Some of us have been moaning about some aspects of the airport's performance in recent times but in provision of service quality it is clearly at the top of the tree.

Bristol Airport wins Best Airport in Europe Award
Created: 6th Mar 2019

Bristol Airport has been awarded the title of Best Airport in Europe for airports in the 5 to 15 million passengers per annum category.

Results based on ACI World’s globally-established Airport Service Quality programme.

Today (Wednesday 6 March) Airports Council International (ACI) World revealed the winners of its world-renowned Airport Service Quality Awards which recognises those airports around the world that delivers the best customer experience in the opinion of their own passengers.

The Airport Service Quality (ASQ) programme is the world’s leading airport passenger service and benchmarking programme measuring passengers’ satisfaction across 37 key performance indicators. During 2018 quarterly surveys were completed, asking passengers to rate their experience through the airport these factors included security, cleanliness and ambience.

Dave Lees, Chief Executive Officer, Bristol Airport said;

“We are delighted to announce that ACI have recognised Bristol Airport as a winner in the 2018 ASQ European 5-15 million passenger category. This is the first year we have won the award and it is an outstanding achievement which highlights the dedicated and continued hard work of all the teams at Bristol Airport.

This award follows on from last year’s achievement, judged by a panel of independent experts at ACI Europe’s annual gala dinner in Brussels, being voted the Best Airport in Europe 5 – 10 million passenger category. Highlighting Bristol’s investment in facilities to enhance the customer experience, public transport improvements and special assistance initiatives such as being an ‘autism friendly’ airport.”

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Effect on BRS of APD devolution to Wales

The Westminster Welsh Affairs Committee held another session today on the subject of APD devolution to Wales.

If anyone hasn’t the time or inclination to watch the full 90-minute video of today’s session, Foxlimayankee has posted an excellent and comprehensive summary in the CWL General thread. The CEOs of CWL and BRS gave verbal evidence to the committee together with a senior director of the Manchester Airports Group. Later there was evidence provided by the Welsh Government’s finance minister and two senior WG officials.

BRS was heavily involved in the discussions and some interesting revelations were made.

The CWL CEO said that Ryanair had told them that BRS was operating at full capacity. This might explain why Ryanair has grown very little in summer at BRS in recent years but substantially in winter when the airport is less busy. It might also be one reason for the expansion of Ryanair services at CWL and the introduction of EXT this year. The BRS CEO rebutted the assertion saying there was still some way to go before the current 10 mppa cap was reached. However, Ryanair might have decided that as as far as they are concerned BRS is at full operational capacity at the moment.

The BRS CEO also said that he had spoken to one of the airlines serving the airport and had been told that they would move some capacity from there to CWL if APD is abolished.

An interesting insight was given by the CWL CEO regarding the Qatar decision to use CWL rather than BRS. She said that the BRS runway was an issue for Qatar and their aircraft could also carry 12 tonnes of freight per flight, an important component of route viability. Qatar were also said to be concerned about ‘the shadow’ of Heathrow and Gatwick over BRS. The BRS CEO replied that some airlines have different criteria for operating the same type of aircraft.

The BRS CEO did say that 2019 was expected to see just over 9 mppa. I’m not sure how that will come about unless some swift replacements are found for some of the lost flybmi routes.

There was the usual disagreement over the impact that APD abolition in Wales would have on BRS. BRS said they would lose one million passengers but CWL said it would be less. They both relied on reports - York and Northpoint, commissioned by BRS and the WG respectively They could not even agree on how many passengers from and to Wales use BRS each year. BRS said it’s 1.8 million but CWL reckon it’s nearer 1.2 million.

 

[Marko1]

I am a bit confused regarding two things - one is that brs is at capacity - there’s now at least 4 extra dep slots since the demise of bmi and the so called shadow of Heathrow - Birmingham is also in the shadow of Heathrow plus Manchester.

I’m guessing the airline in question is Ryanair. Do they really think they could fill a plane to rzeszow twice weekly from Cardiff and surely they wouldn’t leave brs to easyJet alone ?

 

[Jerry]

I’m guessing the airline in question is Ryanair. Do they really think they could fill a plane to rzeszow twice weekly from Cardiff and surely they wouldn’t leave brs to easyJet alone ?

I can only guess but I'd imagine that they would look at probably some of the sun routes and Italy and other Mediterranean routes rather than eastern Europe. I expect Ryanair would still have a large presence at Bristol just that they would increase what they offer at Cardiff.
I think for Ryanair BRS is saturated and Cardiff and Exeter offer a good alternative on certain routes to operate extra flights.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I am a bit confused regarding two things - one is that brs is at capacity - there’s now at least 4 extra dep slots since the demise of bmi and the so called shadow of Heathrow - Birmingham is also in the shadow of Heathrow plus Manchester.

I’m guessing the airline in question is Ryanair. Do they really think they could fill a plane to rzeszow twice weekly from Cardiff and surely they wouldn’t leave brs to easyJet alone ?

I can only guess but I'd imagine that they would look at probably some of the sun routes and Italy and other Mediterranean routes rather than eastern Europe. I expect Ryanair would still have a large presence at Bristol just that they would increase what they offer at Cardiff.
I think for Ryanair BRS is saturated and Cardiff and Exeter offer a good alternative on certain routes to operate extra flights.

The CWL CEO said that Ryanair had told them that Bristol is operating at full capacity. Quite what that means isn't completely clear.

It could relate to the density of passengers passing through the terminal, particularly in the early mornings. It could relate to the number of departures, again particularly in the morning when in the summer months over 30 departures leave between 0600 and 0800, although with the demise of flybmi the number of early morning departures would reduce by five or six, even if the density of passenger numbers didn't reduce by much given the small size of the flybmi aircraft.

The CWL CEO's statement was not challenged by the BRS CEO although he did point out that the local authority passenger cap of 10 mppa still has some way to go before it is reached, and that they are applying to the local authotity for it to be raised to 12 mppa. So in the sense of their planning permissions the airport is not at full capacity but an airline might believe it is from its own perspective.

Like most regional airports BRS has peaks and troughs throughout each day with the mid-morning, mid-afternoon and mid-evening periods the quiter times. It's certainly not operating at peak capacity then. Ryanair with its numerous overseas bases could fly into and out of BRS during these quieter times if it wished, using non-based aircraft. In summer 2013 when it reduced the BRS base from five to two aircraft because of a dispute over airport charges, it maintained the previous summer's schedule (actually slightly increased it) by using non-based aircraft. This had the effect of spreading airline movements more evenly with half a dozen Ryanair arrivals/departures around 2000 hours each evening.

It wasn't so many years ago that Kenny Jacobs, one of Ryanair's senior officers, announced that they wanted to make Ryanair BRS's largest airline presence. That would have been spectacular if they were to overtake easyJet that was already a huge presence at BRS. If BRS is saturated by Ryanair then easyJet must be swamping the place. There are plenty of routes Ryanair could try at BRS yet recently it just seems to want to compete with easyJet routes.

 

[Marko1]

I can never work our Ryanair’s strategy at Bristol and is very unpredictable what they will be offering from season to season. Many of the negatives in the top 10 or so for 2018 could be accounted for by changes in frequencies offered by Ryanair . If Cardiff are basing assumptions that Ryanair will transfer routes or frequencies over to them I would act with caution - look at Belfast (both airports), Glasgow international , Birmingham and Bristol as examples as to how Ryanair change their mind as quickly as the wind changes. I would be careful not to rely on growth to come from them alone

 

[Jerry]

There are plenty of routes Ryanair could try at BRS yet recently it just seems to want to compete with easyJet routes.

I wonder if the problem is that from Ryanair's point of view they aren't getting the incentives to do that? Whereas maybe EZY is hence why Ryanair just seems to be launching on many of the new Easyjet routes maybe in the hope of reducing any profits they make. It was mentioned at the Welsh Affairs Committee that the airport and Flybe have a joint venture. Could BRS have something like that with EZY on many of the new routes that have been launched? It makes me wonder about the BRS FR relationship.
As for the BRS being full most of the flights to EXT and CWL are mainly off peak.

 

[Jerry]

I would be careful not to rely on growth to come from them alone

I think from Cardiffs point of view it's a case of beggars can't be choosers and the growth up until now has generally been cautious.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I can never work our Ryanair’s strategy at Bristol and is very unpredictable what they will be offering from season to season. Many of the negatives in the top 10 or so for 2018 could be accounted for by changes in frequencies offered by Ryanair . If Cardiff are basing assumptions that Ryanair will transfer routes or frequencies over to them I would act with caution - look at Belfast (both airports), Glasgow international , Birmingham and Bristol as examples as to how Ryanair change their mind as quickly as the wind changes. I would be careful not to rely on growth to come from them alone

I don't think that the CWL management does believe that APD devolution would result in a wholesale shifting of capacity whether by Ryanair or others. At least, that's what it's saying publicly and uses its Northpoint report as 'evidence'. Of course, that would assist its desire not to play up any advantage (over BRS) that APD devolution would bring given the Westminster Government's known concern about market distortion.

Ryanair though has a mission to bring down aviation taxes in all the countries in which it operates. In the past it has nearly always 'rewarded' countries that have reduced or abolished their aviation tax. The 'reward' takes the form of increased Ryanair presences in such countries.

On a general point, the BRS policy of relying mainly on existing customer airlines for growth seems increasingly questionable.

 

[superking]

BRS has no need to give lncentives to air lines as they do very well with out buying passengers.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I wonder if the problem is that from Ryanair's point of view they aren't getting the incentives to do that? Whereas maybe EZY is hence why Ryanair just seems to be launching on many of the new Easyjet routes maybe in the hope of reducing any profits they make. It was mentioned at the Welsh Affairs Committee that the airport and Flybe have a joint venture. Could BRS have something like that with EZY on many of the new routes that have been launched? It makes me wonder about the BRS FR relationship.
As for the BRS being full most of the flights to EXT and CWL are mainly off peak.

BRS had a five-year agreement with easyJet which has probably come to the end of its term in the past few months. It was announced publicly at the time. I've read nothing of a new agreement.

If BRS wanted more Ryanair routes and the sticking point was incentives they would obviously have to decide how much they wanted the routes. I imagine that Ryanair gets a good deal anyway as it does at most, probably all, of its airports.

Interestingly though, when the base reduction occurred in 2013, reputedly over peak hour and aircraft parking charges, Ryanair did not reduce its BRS services. It merely replaced the 'lost' based aircraft by aircraft from other bases to maintain the schedule. Neither did it make any public announcement. Normally when Ryanair falls out withan airport it makes a great play publicly about it being the airport's loss and not Ryanair's with the inference that the airline can always find pastures new. I thought at the time that Ryanair didn't really want to sour its BRS relationship too much.

 

[Marko1]

I notice on Twitter that the information screens have been changed and are working with icons etc again

 

[Marko1]

The acl slot allocation report for summer 2019 now available