Route Development & Rumours

[Scania1800]

Ok then Singapore airlines.I don’t know anymore.The airport want expansion but too scared to admit there issues

They turned them down

 

[Birmingham Aviation]

They turned them down

Need something new for next year at least.Delta?

Joking

 

[Nethercote2019]

I think there is a big threshold of 15m pax a year that we probably need to break thru before we can call BHX big enough for some of your hopes

 

[Birmingham Aviation]

I think there is a big threshold of 15m pax a year that we probably need to break thru before we can call BHX big enough for some of your hopes

I said yesterday priority for me is getting
Corendon-Hurghada
Norwegian-Oslo or Helsinki
RAM-Casablanca

 

[davecleaver777]

I said yesterday priority for me is getting
Corendon-Hurghada
Norwegian-Oslo or Helsinki
RAM-Casablanca

I said yesterday priority for me is getting
Corendon-Hurghada
Norwegian-Oslo or Helsinki
RAM-Casablanca

Yesterday it was Austrian now today is another 3 make your mind up

 

[Birmingham Aviation]

Yesterday it was Austrian now today is another 3 make your mind up

And Austrian so that’s 4.Satisfied Dave

 

[rollo]

Yesterday it was Austrian now today is another 3 make your mind up

It was seven yesterday

 

[Birmingham Aviation]

It was seven yesterday

Mate I’m clueless

 

[tompo]

Mate I’m clueless

You said it!

 

[Birmingham Aviation]

You said it!

I know and I’m admitting it!

 

[Ray Finkle]

I'd be very surprised if we saw Austrian back anytime soon.

I can see the bulk of the growth coming from easyjet, Ryanair, Jet2 and hopefully Wizz.

 

[thunderchild]

I really don’t understand the obsession with Austrian, as already stated they’ve reduced MAN to summer seasonal now so no chance of them resuming BHX anytime soon. I think Lufthansa group are more than happy for the traffic to go through FRA and MUC.

If we are talking recapturing lost airlines then I’d be looking at Iberia and Icelandair.

 

[IanFarquharson]

I really don’t understand the obsession with Austrian, as already stated they’ve reduced MAN to summer seasonal now so no chance of them resuming BHX anytime soon. I think Lufthansa group are more than happy for the traffic to go through FRA and MUC.

If we are talking recapturing lost airlines then I’d be looking at Iberia and Icelandair.

Exactly right LH Group are more than happy apx going through FRA and MUC, so Austrian and Brussels are redundant

 

[Birmingham Aviation]

Exactly right LH Group are more than happy apx going through FRA and MUC, so Austrian and Brussels are redundant

Pretty pointless bringing back Brussels

 

[nwoody2001]

Pretty pointless bringing back Brussels

...and therefore Austrian!

 

[Birmingham Aviation]

...and therefore Austrian!

Yes I’d have to give up to agree with you Neil

 

[Ianbutty]

Birmingham Aviation is merely wanting a discussion. Trouble is, and I share his frustration, we are not seeing a lot happening. We have it year after year, and expectations can run ahead of ourselves. when I joined this forum, I was eager for the next exciting move...I was really excited about Pr@#$& flying across the pond, and...ummm.

So many airlines and destinations have come and gone....more gone than come. I would love nothing more than to see the major business cities and capitals of Europe linked into Birmingham, but time has told me to dream on. Yes into, not just out of.

Personally whilst useful for going on holiday, I would not give a too cohoots about Antayla or Egypt links, even if the airline is new. It only takes people out of the region.

For the benefit of the West Midlands economy, we need connections that bring people in...look at how 15 or so daily flights link the US and Canada to Edinburgh on north american airlines bringing in all that spending power to the region...not taking people from Edinburgh to the US and Canada...UK based airlines would do that. Well done to EDI but it covers the whole of Scotland.

Let's be realistic, but respectful, that we need to balance what is right for the region against the realism of our geography and the propensity for people to fly into the region.

I love your enthusiasm Birmingham Aviation, but old hats like me, know that patience is the virtue needed here and only time will tell.

 

[jfy1999]

thank you @Ianbutty for your considered post and for reminding us to stay respectful…

I think @Birmingham Aviation questions deserve answering so I will just give my twopence worth of thoughts…

speaking as someone who frequently flies to Vienna and has used various airlines and UK airports to do so, demand for Vienna from the UK is overwhelmingly tourist based and therefore most airports rely on LCC flights or weekend breaks with the likes of Jet2.

I’m usually just travelling with hand luggage and I don’t have an onward connection, so I’ll go for the cheapest option every time. I’ve used Austrian only once and other options are consistently 2-3x cheaper. Since I’m not looking for any onward connections, I’d have no reason to use Austrian over any other options. Even when flights are available from BHX, options from other airports are often much cheaper even when you factor in coach/train travel.

I’ve booked Jet2 on BHX-VIE 3 times and I’ve found demand has been very weak outside of peak holiday season. Only one of those flights was well over 50% full and that was at Easter. One of my Jet2 flights was cancelled and all the BHX passengers were reassigned to a Manchester flight!

The overwhelming majority of flights to airports outside LHR are provided by Ryanair/Wizz. I think they are the only ones who can make a 2-3 weekly BHX-VIE service work year round.

 

[nwoody2001]

Birmingham Aviation is merely wanting a discussion. Trouble is, and I share his frustration, we are not seeing a lot happening. We have it year after year, and expectations can run ahead of ourselves. when I joined this forum, I was eager for the next exciting move...I was really excited about Pr@#$& flying across the pond, and...ummm.

So many airlines and destinations have come and gone....more gone than come. I would love nothing more than to see the major business cities and capitals of Europe linked into Birmingham, but time has told me to dream on. Yes into, not just out of.

Personally whilst useful for going on holiday, I would not give a too cohoots about Antayla or Egypt links, even if the airline is new. It only takes people out of the region.

For the benefit of the West Midlands economy, we need connections that bring people in...look at how 15 or so daily flights link the US and Canada to Edinburgh on north american airlines bringing in all that spending power to the region...not taking people from Edinburgh to the US and Canada...UK based airlines would do that. Well done to EDI but it covers the whole of Scotland.

Let's be realistic, but respectful, that we need to balance what is right for the region against the realism of our geography and the propensity for people to fly into the region.

I love your enthusiasm Birmingham Aviation, but old hats like me, know that patience is the virtue needed here and only time will tell.

This response here - in my opinion - perfectly demonstrates the mismatch some people show on this forum between their dreams and the realities with regard to a) the role of the airport and b) the region it serves.

To be comparing Birmingham with Edinburgh personally is a fruitless task destined to guarantee disappointment. Just because Edinburgh maybe half the size of Birmingham by population, Edinburgh is:

- A huge inbound tourist destination
- A capital city, and
- A gateway into an entire country.

And its airport serves the city in fulfilling this role well. Birmingham are none of these things and will never be any of those things. Edinburgh has not become either of those things because it has 15 daily flights to the states, its has attracted 15 daily flights to the states because it is already all of those things. It is not the airport that made the city into what it is today, it is the city that made the airport into what it is today - and all us Birmingham and BHX enthusiasts need to recognise this. To make things worse, the outbound business traffic BHX used to be able to depend on, no longer exists since the growth of remote working and covid.

However, Birmingham is one of the largest cities in the UK. Birmingham has a massive outbound tourist market. Birmingham has a massive catchment. There are plenty of things going for the city and the airport, but they are not EVER going to relate to Edinburgh. The reality here, for BHX to attract the routes that us enthusiast desire, it first has to attract the market and catchment. Manchester is able to attract those routes because the airport has captured that market and demand and now carries 2-3x more pax than BHX. And like BHX, a vast majority of the pax using Manchester will be outbound tourist markets.

So unfortunately Ian, if we want to attract those routes you so desire, we need to attract the demand, the catchment and the market first, and only then will those bigger "sexier" airlines take note... We could attract/buy in an airline tomorrow flying daily flights to JFK, but if we don't have the market to fill those planes, that route is not going to last long.

So respectfully, whilst you "would not give a too cohoots about Antayla or Egypt links, even if the airline is new. It only takes people out of the region." ...they bring people to the airport. And big airlines pay more attention to big airports.

 

[route66]

This response here - in my opinion - perfectly demonstrates the mismatch some people show on this forum between their dreams and the realities with regard to a) the role of the airport and b) the region it serves.

To be comparing Birmingham with Edinburgh personally is a fruitless task destined to guarantee disappointment. Just because Edinburgh maybe half the size of Birmingham by population, Edinburgh is:

- A huge inbound tourist destination
- A capital city, and
- A gateway into an entire country.

And its airport serves the city in fulfilling this role well. Birmingham are none of these things and will never be any of those things. Edinburgh has not become either of those things because it has 15 daily flights to the states, its has attracted 15 daily flights to the states because it is already all of those things. It is not the airport that made the city into what it is today, it is the city that made the airport into what it is today - and all us Birmingham and BHX enthusiasts need to recognise this. To make things worse, the outbound business traffic BHX used to be able to depend on, no longer exists since the growth of remote working and covid.

However, Birmingham is one of the largest cities in the UK. Birmingham has a massive outbound tourist market. Birmingham has a massive catchment. There are plenty of things going for the city and the airport, but they are not EVER going to relate to Edinburgh. The reality here, for BHX to attract the routes that us enthusiast desire, it first has to attract the market and catchment. Manchester is able to attract those routes because the airport has captured that market and demand and now carries 2-3x more pax than BHX. And like BHX, a vast majority of the pax using Manchester will be outbound tourist markets.

So unfortunately Ian, if we want to attack those routes you so desire, we need to attract the demand, the catchment and the market first, and only then will those bigger "sexier" airlines take note... We could attract/buy in an airline tomorrow flying daily flights to JFK, but if we don't have the market to fill those planes, that route is not going to last long.

So respectfully, whilst you "would not give a too cohoots about Antayla or Egypt links, even if the airline is new. It only takes people out of the region." ...they bring people to the airport. And big airlines pay more attention to big airports.

I agree with everything you say, but it's not that long ago that BHX was ahead of Edinburgh in the passenger stakes. For some reason the North American market hadn't discovered Edinburgh until relatively recently.