Flybe

[Finger66]

One further thing to remember in all of this is that nothing Flybe end up doing or not doing should never surprise us, so who knows what we may or may not end up with from them service wise. BHD def here to stay. NQY doing well even with the subsidy. DUS should certainly do ok, if not very well. The convenience of a direct flight is still important albeit not at the best times. Time will tell on this one but I think there may be more to come!

 

[whoshotjimmi]

To be fair, my comparison of DSA-CDG to LBA-CDG is based largely on the fact that LBA has been unable to sustain at least a daily operation for a while now. I appreciate that this is based on the principle that the Jet2 offering is aimed primarily at leisure passengers and is timed in such a way to maximise this. On the face of it, the timings are not too dissimilar to those on the new LBA-DUS service, which is why I'm cautious. That sort of timing is perfect for leisure pax but will it meet the needs of the majority of business people? I'm not so sure. When we talk about the 4pm departure time Jet2 offered, we are talking about an hour here and there that wouldn't really make a lot of difference to productivity. The Flybe service is right in the middle of the working day and, taxis or no taxis, passengers won't be able to do a good day's work on the day they fly.

With regards the frequency at DSA to CDG, until not long ago, it provided an excellent option into skyteam and the worldwide options were palpable. Considering it is only as far as Manchester from most of the Northern cities, easier to get to by car (no M62) and was considerably cheaper than the rivals, I would have expected it to have been more popular, even if it still didn't necessarily meet its targets.

To then compare that back to LBA, would Flybe have the same sort of optimism to be twice daily from LBA IF they did do it in the future if they took into account the current service provision and their own failure at DSA? Particularly when there has been nothing to suggest is what LBA needs. The last time LBA had that sort of service was a good 10 years ago. I used the service myself - there was no one on board. I remember the flight being dirt cheap too.

I get the apples and pears argument but it is up to Flybe to make that decision. If DUS works for them, it may tempt them to have a look at other things but, as I've said already, I believe the higher priced, less conveniently timed flights will be a barrier to its success.

 

[Finger66]

If someone had told me a few years ago that LBA - DUS would support a 6 x weekly B733 service I would have laughed at them and to be honest it is the phasing out of these a/c that has contributed to its downfall. So on the basis BE are basically not having to build the route up from scratch, they are operating a smaller and more economical aircraft then this will work for them. There is a likelihood that LS has pax booked already beyond the end of October which will have meant a transfer to the new BE flights or a refund with advice on the new operator. That's a good early but of advertising in anyone's book. I also have it on very good authority that PM, and probably SH too, at LS are in almost constant contact with other airlines. I suspect therefore that quite a good deal has been constructed here. I fully appreciate the timings are not perfect, but if the testing of the water does work as it should then who knows how that may improve going forwards

 

[michael]

Without veering too much from FlyBe to Jet2 with some of the last few posts mentioning the phasing out of the B733's I thought I'd have a look at the ages of the more recently acquired B733's
G GDFT, FN, FM, FL, FO are all either 18 or 19 yrs old according to airfleets. By my reckoning this gives them 11 years of service left compared to G CELA which is now over 30 years old. Ok the type will eventually be phased out but these 18 year old aircraft must be along way from reincarnation in to Coke cans which might give some of the routes a bit of longevity.
Please feel free to move this to the Jet2 thread if required

 

[Finger66]

Very fair point Michael however it's more than LBA that have based B733's so just because half a dozen aircraft have a few years left in them doesn't mean to say that home will be at LBA and may therefore impact on the city routes. That said, as has been pointed out, the B738 is a far more economical a/c to operate so nothing is for certain in all of this. I still say there will be more Flybe routes to come as they finally realise the LBA potential. Something Jet2 have already done masses to promote and utilise

 

[lbaspotter]

Well i didn't see this one coming, Did anyone else!

Flybe will re-start to sell flights from Leeds/Bradford to both Southampton and Aberdeen once again but this time using Eastern Airways aircraft after the 2 airlines announced a new franchise partnership this morning.

http://uk.advfn.com/stock-market/lo...C-Flybe-Agreement-with-Eastern-Airwa/74931839

 

[Bigman]

Now I just wonder if this could be the catalyst for an extra based Eastern to operate 2 x daily CDG with the 6 x weekly DUS. This would of course mean that Flybe would not have to fly the routes themselves, and would spread the risk of Eastern doing it as a stand alone job, and we could perhaps get an AF codeshare??

 

[lbaspotter]

Now I just wonder if this could be the catalyst for an extra based Eastern to operate 2 x daily CDG with the 6 x weekly DUS. This would of course mean that Flybe would not have to fly the routes themselves, and would spread the risk of Eastern doing it as a stand alone job, and we could perhaps get an AF codeshare??

Can't see that happening straight away.
Looks like only 4x Eastern Airways aircraft are going to be branded into Flybe colours to be used on its new Scottish routes between Aberdeen-Sumburgh, Glasgow-Sumburgh, Edinburgh-Sumburgh, Glasgow-Manchester, Aberdeen-Kirkwall, and Glasgow-Stornoway. It smacks off flybe sticking 2 fingers up at Loganair as they'll be competing on these routes.

All other Eastern Airways flights will continue to operate in Eastern branded aircraft but have a codeshare with flybe.

 

[leedslad]

I used the Jet2 dusseldorf service for a winter city break purely based on the convenient Friday evening/Sunday evening timings meaning no time off work required. Think the prices were fairly low too.

Appreciate leisure to dusseldorf won't be a focus but shame if the option of a weekend away without time off work now lost.

 

[White Heather]

I wonder if the Flybe/Eastern agreement will result in an overall increase in passenger numbers? If so, and if it is true that Eastern are looking to re-equip with ATR42's, then with people booking through Flybe, as well as Eastern, there is a better chance of operating with sustainable loads. And at least now it is another two destinations available with Flybe from LBA once the GLA route switches to Loganair - Aberdeen, Southampton, Newquay, Belfast City & Dusseldorf. Overall a positive step I think and seems like something that both airlines need, and neither seem to be doing so well at the moment.

 

[lbaspotter]

WOW! Fighting talk from Loganair’s managing director Jonathan Hinkles, judging by this article his not a happy man after todays news.

http://www.shetlandtimes.co.uk/2017/06/06/flybe-go-loganair-direct-competition-flights

Good news for him it looke like the new Loganair will continue to offer codeshare agreement with British Airways and start a new partnership with bmi regional.

http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/highlands-and-islands-air-battle-launched-1-4467379

 

[White Heather]

That article seems to be suggesting that Flybe were still in negotiation with Loganair whilst at the same time setting up a deal with a rival. Sounds like a scenario closer to home!

 

[Jerry]

Surely it would make more sense for Flybe not keep all it's eggs in one basket? Also they may have wanted the internal Scottish flights to be in aircraft in their livery rather than just a codeshare, i'd have thought that would give them more control and security for their passengers. There's also another consideration that Eastern operate other UK routes while Loganair is more just a Scottish airline. By joining up with Eastern it means Flybe can gain access to it's customers on routes like LBA-SOU for it's SOU hub as well as smaller aircraft for some of it's routes or potential routes that the Dash could be too big for or it doesn't have jets for.

 

[Bigman]

...which is why I mooted the idea that they could use Eastern to operate a 2 x daily CDG on their behalf with a SB2000 instead of a bigger DH8/400. Eastern already have their crew base in place, so an extra based plane should not be too onerous to arrange. Also, FlyBe would not have to find an additional aircraft to operate it. Makes sense to me...but what do I know!!

 

[LeedsPilot]

Hopefully this new franchise deal will help to grow passenger numbers on the existing routes and potentially help stabilise Eastern a bit after their recent internal issues. Personally though, I would much prefer mainline Flybe to open new routes rather than doing so with Eastern. Unless Eastern makes a big change to their ticket pricing if/when it converts to an ATR42 operation, they will continue to drive out leisure and VFR traffic completely on the routes and ensure only the business users use the route.

 

[Finger66]

I think it isvonce again important we remain slightly cautious about all this in much the same way as whoshotjimmi alluded to when the DUS route was announced. That said, this new arrangement can only be a good thing, especially once it all settles down. Both airlines already op from LBA, one with a crew base, so I do agree that all these recent announcements could just be what Flybe, Eastern and LBA need to grow and utilise the LBA potential to its max

 

[lbaspotter]

Got to admit the Eastern Airways BAe Jetstream 41 aircraft are going to look strange in Flybe's purple livery.

What with using the power of Flybe's brand, I'm hoping Eastern Airways can rebuild it's reputation and make a real success of this franchise.
Whilst at the same time I also hope they look at opening further new routes from LBA.

 

[lbaspotter]

Looks like we going to see further Flybe flights at LBA next summer 2018..

As it would seem that Flybe have been chosen by Inghams Holidays to operate the weekly Leeds/Bradford - Innsbruck charter flight next summer 2018 season. Holidays are now on sale and flights will continue be operated every Saturday from June 9th running up until September 15th with a non based aircraft as follows.

BEE9225 = INN: 10:30 – LBA: 11:35 / BEE9226 = LBA: 12:05 – INN: 15:10

I think after this years fiasco anything that brings back stability has to be better option for Inghams. It's seen 5 different operators this summer so far with; CityJet, Titan Airways, Jota Aviation, Carpatar Air & Trade Air along with the fact some flights even went to Salzburg instead.

 

[White Heather]

True, although its nice to see the F100s and a variety of equipment rather than a rather uninspiring Flybe Q400.

 

[Jerry]

True, although its nice to see the F100s and a variety of equipment rather than a rather uninspiring Flybe Q400.

Is it going to be a Q400? May well be an E jet.