A new airport.... South Yorkshire Airport City?

Doncaster Sheffield Airport Strategic Review Announcement​

Forums4airports discusses the latest press release from Doncaster Sheffield airport where the airport questions the future of the airport. The owners of the airport, the Peel Group have announced they are looking at their options as the group has decided the airport is no longer viable as an operational airport. Here's the press release:

"The Board of Doncaster Sheffield Airport (DSA) has begun a review of strategic options for the Airport. This review follows lengthy deliberations by the Board of DSA which has reluctantly concluded that aviation activity on the site may no longer be commercially viable.

DSA’s owner, the Peel Group, as the Airport’s principal funder, has reviewed the conclusions of the Board of DSA and commissioned external independent advice in order to evaluate and test the conclusions drawn, which concurs with the Board’s initial findings.

Since the Peel Group acquired the Airport site in 1999 and converted it into an international commercial airport, which opened in 2005, significant amounts have been invested in the terminal, the airfield and its operations, both in relation to the original conversion and subsequently to improve the facilities and infrastructure on offer to create an award winning airport.

However, despite growth in passenger numbers, DSA has never achieved the critical mass required to become profitable and this fundamental issue of a shortfall in passenger numbers is exacerbated by the announcement on 10 June 2022 of the unilateral withdrawal of the Wizz Air based aircraft, leaving the Airport with only one base carrier, namely TUI.

This challenge has been increased by other changes in the aviation market, the well-publicised impact of the COVID-19 pandemic and increasingly important environmental considerations. It has therefore been concluded that aviation activity may no longer be the use for the site which delivers the maximum economic and environmental benefit to the region. Against this backdrop, DSA and the Peel Group, will initiate a consultation and engagement programme with stakeholders on the future of the site and how best to maximise and capitalise on future economic growth opportunities for Doncaster and the wider Sheffield City Region.

The wider Peel Group is already delivering significant development and business opportunities on its adjoining GatewayEast development including the recent deal for over 400,000 sq ft logistics and advanced manufacturing development on site, creating hundreds of new jobs and delivering further economic investment in the region.

Robert Hough, Chairman of Peel Airports Group, which includes Doncaster Sheffield Airport, said: “It is a critical time for aviation globally. Despite pandemic related travel restrictions slowly drawing to a close, we are still facing ongoing obstacles and dynamic long-term threats to the future of the aviation industry. The actions by Wizz to sacrifice its base at Doncaster to shore up its business opportunities at other bases in the South of England are a significant blow for the Airport.

Now is the right time to review how DSA can best create future growth opportunities for Doncaster and for South Yorkshire. The Peel Group remains committed to delivering economic growth, job opportunities and prosperity for Doncaster and the wider region.”

DSA and the Peel Group pride themselves on being forward-thinking whilst prioritising the welfare of staff and customers alike. As such, no further public comments will be made whilst they undertake this engagement period with all stakeholders.
During the Strategic Review, the Airport will operate as normal. Therefore passengers who are due to travel to the airport, please arrive and check in as normal. If there are any disruptions with your flight, you will be contacted by your airline in good time.
For all press enquiries, please contact Charlotte Leach at [email protected]."

"Not great news for DSA or the region"

Should the government or local council foot the bill and provide a financial subsidy to keep the airport open, thoughts...?

 

we is Turley who where peel and dmbc advisors


the point im making is there is plenty of scope for development for cargo ,and a massive landbank which LBA does not have, nor does it have the transport links that DSA as .

There are actually plans to build a large employment hub at LBA (a Leeds City Council project), located directly behind the existing ex Avro Shadow Factory, which will also bring with it a new access road that benefits the airport.
A rail parkway station serving both the airport and employment hub is currently in planning and scheduled for opening in 2026.

You seem to be ignoring though that East Midlands is in a far better location than DSA and already established as a major cargo hub. And, it's growing. Freight airlines are not going to move from EMA to DSA at huge cost. Why would they? Even if they were allowed to fly to DSA for free, the costs of relocating would wipe out any savings generated by DSAs incentives. It's just never going to happen.

 

May I just interject to say I’m pleased we are receiving more balance on this thread now. Well aware I’ve helped to make it a bit of an echo chamber in more recent times.

Regarding Wizz UK and the statement that Peel indicated they may not honour the agreement. I think that’s 6 of one half dozen of the other. Wizzair agreed to base 3 aircraft at DSA. Contracted rates are usually based on volume I.e base more aircraft, increase footfall, pay less. When they reduced that commitment to one they would have broken the contracted agreement on rates/rebates and therefore be liable to pay more.

In my view Wizzair UK changed their minds like they did at CWL and what DSA said is more than likely correct, they wanted to shore up their LTN and LGW operations. Sad really, because I saw it as a turning point when they announced the base. It seemed to make sense to me, but obviously they didn’t see it that way,

 

we is Turley who where peel and dmbc advisors

thanks.

sorry, just to clairfy, you work for Turley Associates, or you are just posting what they said?

 

thanks.

sorry, just to clairfy, you work for Turley Associates, or you are just posting what they said?

posting what they say, i run a construction company.

 

what you all forget LBA become a regional airport in 1985 the biggest airport in yorkshire and in 1997 1.2million passengers. DSA was moving in the right direction and then covid

dsa in the same period of years reached 1.3 million.

That's irrelevant as far fewer people flew from smaller regional airports in the years up to 1997, plus in those years LBA was council owned, denied funding, and often prevented from development for political gain. DSA arrived at a time of significant growth in aviation generally and whilst you suggest it was growing quickly in the years up to COVID, it still didn't outgrow LBA passenger growth over the same period. In fact, even pre COVID, DSA passenger figures were up and down like a yo-yo, and never got anywhere near the 3.5m per year that Peel stated was needed to break even. Effectively, it was stagnating. No sustained growth at all.

 

That's irrelevant as far fewer people flew from smaller regional airports in the years up to 1997, plus in those years LBA was council owned, denied funding, and often prevented from development for political gain. DSA arrived at a time of significant growth in aviation generally and whilst you suggest it was growing quickly in the years up to COVID, it still didn't outgrow LBA passenger growth over the same period. In fact, even pre COVID, DSA passenger figures were up and down like a yo-yo, and never got anywhere near the 3.5m per year that Peel stated was needed to break even. Effectively, it was stagnating. No sustained growth at all.

passenger numbers at DSA are as irrelevant, as you mention planning for a rail link at LBA, that is not going to happen. i will wager you what you want , (given to the forum) theres a flight out of DSA, before , LBA gets a rail link.

There are actually plans to build a large employment hub at LBA (a Leeds City Council project), located directly behind the existing ex Avro Shadow Factory, which will also bring with it a new access road that benefits the airport.
A rail parkway station serving both the airport and employment hub is currently in planning and scheduled for opening in 2026.

You seem to be ignoring though that East Midlands is in a far better location than DSA and already established as a major cargo hub. And, it's growing. Freight airlines are not going to move from EMA to DSA at huge cost. Why would they? Even if they were allowed to fly to DSA for free, the costs of relocating would wipe out any savings generated by DSAs incentives. It's just never going to happen.

amazon uses EMA and sends all its freight up to doncaster. its biggest center in northern england, 6 minutes from DSA, thats why they would

 

it will be empty as it is not finished yet, the biggest in the north of england

Is the Panatonni factory still sat as a white elephant it was last time I passed the airport a few months back?

https://www.loopnet.co.uk/Listing/Lincoln-Green-Way-Doncaster/25784247/

still not finished

Really what they working 1 on 5 off didn't they start building it before the airport shut surely it would be finished by now? The last time I went past it looked well operational to me.

Unfortunately as much as I wish you well in the debate this forum has in recent times seen a handful of DSA supporters come and go very quickly without any real case put forward to support DSA being viable.

With the greatest respect everything you've posted is a copy and paste job from times gone by with nothing to back any of it up with real facts and figures. To turn DSA around it will need a near miracle you've stated nothing from an aviation point of view to say how DSA becomes viable. The majority of DSA supporters are relying on what Ros Jones and the DSA advisors say when aviation experts elsewhere are warning against the place reopening.

People want to hear how does a new operator achieve success with the same airlines that have previously walked away what's going to change unless they've new airlines lined up to succeed where others failed.

I'm not going over old ground I believe the airport could fair better with a new owner by how much is debatable though but Peel won't sell and would anyone want to risk buying the place.

This new operator without TUI and Wizz back in the building with operations the same size or bigger it's an absolute non starter and Wizz say they'd not comeback if they did it would be with a significantly reduced programme anyway 2-3-4 routes they'd already cut the programme at DSA by 20-25% what it was at the height of Wizz operations at least some of that was down to base closures elsewhere.

 

why i have to copy and paste , is simple when i said something its discount,
ie, pug - peel did not want public money- i copied and paste where they had asked for it
i can copy and paste for you where it says it is not ready for letting as not complete.
and i can see why all people leave who want DSA to be an airport is the negativity on here against.
you copy and paster were an avation expert says it is not viable.
copy and paste the record of peel regarding airports

 

rabbit foot, I think what Rob DSA is trying to say is that you are copying and pasting statements and some of them are out of context to the discussion, for instance the example you used of Peel refusing to accept further public subsidy.

York Aviation have voiced their concerns. Obviously that led certain groups to attempt to invalidate their statement by suggesting they’re somehow in the pockets of peel which is nonsense.

Interested for you to substantiate your claim that Amazon fly their goods into EMA to ship them to Doncaster. I’m interested in that, can you provide further detail?

 

did you use DSA much @rabbitfoot ? if so roughly how many times and what routes?

 

why i have to copy and paste , is simple when i said something its discount,
ie, pug - peel did not want public money- i copied and paste where they had asked for it
i can copy and paste for you where it says it is not ready for letting as not complete.
and i can see why all people leave who want DSA to be an airport is the negativity on here against.
you copy and paster were an avation expert says it is not viable.
copy and paste the record of peel regarding airports

Copy and paste away, personally I would love to know which airlines are going to operate and succeed when they tried and failed before or didn't want anything to do with the place first time around not one new poster on the topic has answered that question in recent months that is a fact that holds true.

did you use DSA much @rabbitfoot ? if so roughly how many times and what routes?

I'll answer that one to give some context

Take out Covid and not going abroad some years once out of 10-11 holidays I would say whilst the airport was open.

TUI - Rhodes many years ago

Reason why I used DSA so little - price of a holiday from DSA

 

Copy and paste away, personally I would love to know which airlines are going to operate and succeed when they tried and failed before or didn't want anything to do with the place first time around not one new poster on the topic has answered that question in recent months that is a fact that holds true.

It’s possible that a new operator will bring with it established relationships. Doesn’t always work though, Peel and easyjet/Ryanair is a case in point.

I still cannot understand why easyjet were never able to establish themselves at DSA, if the airport has the potential that is claimed, they would to me have been the ideal partner to drive growth as they have so little presence east of the Pennines. If I were to be an aspiring opco I would be moving mountains to get them to invest in a three aircraft operation, and getting TUI back.

Reopening to the status quo isn’t going to cut it.

As for Amazon, I believe they currently use ASL who have an established base at East Midlands.

 

It’s possible that a new operator will bring with it established relationships. Doesn’t always work though, Peel and easyjet/Ryanair is a case in point.

I still cannot understand why easyjet were never able to establish themselves at DSA, if the airport has the potential that is claimed, they would to me have been the ideal partner to drive growth as they have so little presence east of the Pennines. If I were to be an aspiring opco I would be moving mountains to get them to invest in a three aircraft operation, and getting TUI back.

Reopening to the status quo isn’t going to cut it.

As for Amazon, I believe they currently use ASL who have an established base at East Midlands.

Very true the first point but will that fill planes Peel had relationships with both airlines at LPL.

Having read many posts of yours you seem a very knowledgeable poster above the norm in regards to the industry in general and appearing from posts your background. I struggle to see anything bar bucket and spades coming back personally.

Best case scenario if and still a big if the airport opens so many challenges to overcome. I would think a little ambitious year one re TUI and not for a minute what i think would happen.

But the place would need a flying start

TUI - base 4/5 aircraft as was summer, 2 aircraft winter
Wizz - Are somehow enticed back with 3-4 routes significantly down on before but with aircraft issues to boot surely not happening
2 Excel - Back bigger than before, Hangar 2 in tow
Flying school or schools back

One Air enticed to base
Cargo in general- Warehouse space permitting they chase anything and everything
Training flights - They manage to get them back and in number
Government flights - Every little helps

Like I say I don't think that would be possible but what else could they get without the loco.

 

Not suggesting I know more than anyone else, I have seen enough to determine that the previous operator(s) didn’t mismanage it to the extent that is claimed, and the problem, if there was one, was not high charges and dodgy inter-company transactions. I’ve never been a fan of Peel as a business, they have a lot of land and are able to gain public funding by the bucket load but are to all intents and purposes an unaccountable behemoth, but DSA was their flagship and there is no evidence to suggest they wanted it to fail, far from it!

2Excel will return, they are the one company that have been royally screwed by the whole thing as they’ve made such a big investment in their operational HQ.

Flying Clubs perhaps, but I doubt Aeros would return as they’ve invested heavily in Leeds East now.

Cargo, don’t know. Would need a lot of investment to make it a competitive option. Might pick up some of the stuff it got in the past but it was niche air freight and not the type that really pays the bills, unless there’s a lot more of it.

 

Copy and paste away, personally I would love to know which airlines are going to operate and succeed when they tried and failed before or didn't want anything to do with the place first time around not one new poster on the topic has answered that question in recent months that is a fact that holds true.


I'll answer that one to give some context

Take out Covid and not going abroad some years once out of 10-11 holidays I would say whilst the airport was open.

TUI - Rhodes many years ago

Reason why I used DSA so little - price of a holiday from DSA

did wizz quite a few times , but manchester to us/ germany
, use LBA the most now.

 

TUI’s supportive noises about DSA reopening have to be seen in the context that any airline with aircraft based in the region would be happy to see DSA reopen, even if they have zero intention of using it.

This is because having a local alternative, one that is desperate for their business, is in the airline’s favour when negotiating terms at their existing bases. An airline might not intend to base at DSA, but having the option to move gives them an advantage.

Ryanair, of course, are the masters at this kind of arm-twisting. How much do you imagine they are paying at Glasgow, for example, when Prestwick is just down the road? Notice that they consistently base most of their aircraft at Glasgow, however, and Prestwick is left constantly teetering on the edge of viability.

 

Not suggesting I know more than anyone else, I have seen enough to determine that the previous operator(s) didn’t mismanage it to the extent that is claimed, and the problem, if there was one, was not high charges and dodgy inter-company transactions. I’ve never been a fan of Peel as a business, they have a lot of land and are able to gain public funding by the bucket load but are to all intents and purposes an unaccountable behemoth, but DSA was their flagship and there is no evidence to suggest they wanted it to fail, far from it!

2Excel will return, they are the one company that have been royally screwed by the whole thing as they’ve made such a big investment in their operational HQ.

Flying Clubs perhaps, but I doubt Aeros would return as they’ve invested heavily in Leeds East now.

Cargo, don’t know. Would need a lot of investment to make it a competitive option. Might pick up some of the stuff it got in the past but it was niche air freight and not the type that really pays the bills, unless there’s a lot more of it.

I think your misreading me slightly I'm not suggesting your saying you know more than others just you obviously know your stuff.

On mismanagement do you feel that it did happen to a point with your statement above?

At the end of the day it's still very much a waiting game on what actually happens if anything I just hope if DSA does come back from the dead it's back to stay a vanity project from the council with airlines and operator departing quick sharp will put the people who have campaigned for a reopening seriously in the firing line and rightly so.

 

why i have to copy and paste , is simple when i said something its discount,
ie, pug - peel did not want public money- i copied and paste where they had asked for it
i can copy and paste for you where it says it is not ready for letting as not complete.
and i can see why all people leave who want DSA to be an airport is the negativity on here against.
you copy and paster were an avation expert says it is not viable.
copy and paste the record of peel regarding airports

Most people on the forum are aviation enthusiasts, others working or retired from the 'industry' and posting facts with a knowledge base some of which might be unpalatable in some quarters. I don't think that this needs be interpreted as inherently 'anti' DSA - I doubt anyone was keen for it to close. It is a fact that Peel opened the airport against much independent and not so independent advice and stuck to their guns which in one respect was admirable. Unfortunately their vision did not come to fruition and they have paid dearly for it but fair enough it was their own money! It is a fact that they employed top people in the industry to run it. The question of course which cannot be answered yet is whether a new operator - if there is agreement reached on one - will do any better and whilst we are finding out, how much public money is expended to support it (Yorkshiremen with short arms and deep pockets) and being paid to Peel in respect of the lease with which no doubt they will be delighted in order to recoup some revenue. If there is a new operator who can establish a different passenger/route model to that on offer from nearby airports that people are prepared to travel for then perhaps there is a chance but to replicate what has gone on before seems at very high risk of repeating Peels' disappointment and that is far from being 'anti' DSA. The negative for me will be that it is no longer Peels' money but 'ours'.

 

I think your misreading me slightly I'm not suggesting your saying you know more than others just you obviously know your stuff.

On mismanagement do you feel that it did happen to a point with your statement above?

At the end of the day it's still very much a waiting game on what actually happens if anything I just hope if DSA does come back from the dead it's back to stay a vanity project from the council with airlines and operator departing quick sharp will put the people who have campaigned for a reopening seriously in the firing line and rightly so.

I’m saying there is no evidence of any mishandling of the business, and the rumours of the airport being expensive to airlines are not true. Of course we don’t know what happened in discussions between airport and airline execs, CH might have slapped Michael O’Leary in the face with a wet fish for all we know*, but the packages on offer were generous and aimed at creating tangible and sustainable growth. Starting new routes is a risky business, risk is a significant factor in operations at all airlines, when an airport is littered with failed attempts it makes the job difficult to near impossible to recover.

Easyjet however, if there really is a market for it, could replicate the success TUI saw by investing a huge amount in marketing DSA as a viable alternative to passengers from Leicester to Leeds and everywhere in between, that they didn’t last time suggests they weren’t that interested, could the increase in sales post covid cause them to re think? Would need a lot of financial support from the airport initially.

*I jest, the people at the business end of the airport were astute and wanted it to succeed.

 

Please don't feed the troll as he/she laps it up. I suspected it to be thus for some time before my specific questions were left unanswered but the another question was answered as that was easier to copy/paste a reply.

I stopped feeding it then.