Cardiff Airport - General Thread

[Jerry]

If they are going along the MAN/BHX path they'd be looking to investors rather than the private sector buying the airport completely.

The private investor part of the BHX ownership, with just under 50% of the equity, is Ontario Teachers' Pension Plan (it also own Bristol Airport outright). OTPP is one of the largest institutional investors in the world with over 170 billion Canadian dollars (about £100 billion) worth of assets.

MAN is owned by Manchester Airports Group (MAG) which also owns Bournemouth, East Midlands and Stansted airports. The private investment part with just over a third of the equity is the Australian investment fund, IFM Investors.

In the cases of both BHX and MAN the public sector parts of the ownership comes from local authorities around Birmingham and Manchester respectively.

In CWL's case any private sector investor would be partnering a national government rather than local authorities but I'm not aware of any reason why this could not work as well as it does with local authority partners.

So the WAG might be looking for an investor to partner them bringing in additional funding, or an experienced airport operator to take over the running of the airport. From recent pronouncements it seems the former path is more likely.

Would be a bit ironic if they do get investors and they were OTPP! That i think is still a while away but the airport does seem to be in good hands and recovering nicely.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Very quiet at the moment re things-CWL but I see today that Owen Smith will be going against Jeremy Corbyn in the Labour Party leadership stakes now that Angela Eagle has withdrawn.

It would be an interesting development in the future if Owen Smith became PM given his Welsh background and he is currently MP for Pontypridd. It might not be bad news for CWL as he would probably be inclined to ensure that Wales received its slice of the cake.

 

[Jerry]

Very quiet at the moment re things-CWL but I see today that Owen Smith will be going against Jeremy Corbyn in the Labour Party leadership stakes now that Angela Eagle has withdrawn.

It would be an interesting development in the future if Owen Smith became PM given his Welsh background and he is currently MP for Pontypridd. It might not be bad news for CWL as he would probably be inclined to ensure that Wales received its slice of the cake.

Yeah it is quiet! Hoping there might be something new announced for S17 but that could be a while off yet. Hoping Ryanair might find a spare plane from somewhere! Or Jet2!
I don't know much about him though i do know he's not tainted by voting for the Iraq War and i believe he's proper left wing Labour. Would be good to have a Welsh Prime Minister again, I believe it's been a while!
I don't know where he stands on devolution and whether he would devolve everything including APD but I think he would be more friendly to Wales but he would have to make Labour electable again and beat Jeremy Corbyn which will be 2 huge tasks!

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I suppose David Lloyd George was the last Welsh prime minister (the only one so far?) although he was actually born in the north of England, albeit to Welsh parents and he was brought up speaking Welsh. James Callaghan was Welsh by political adoption having served as MP for Cardiff constituencies for over 40 years although he was born in Portsmouth and seems 'English' in all other respects.

Let's hope that if there is another Welsh prime minister he or she doesn't have a world war to contend with as Lloyd George did when he became premier.

Looking to one scenario in the perhaps foreseeable future, if the next general election returned Labour as the biggest party but with no overall majority and the Lib Dems for whatever reason were unable to provide the deciding balance, it may be that a Labour leader would turn to the Scottish Nationalists and Plaid Cymru for support. The Scots Nats would almost certainly demand another independence referendum as their price and PC would probably want more devolution including APD. Now that would be a head scratcher for a Labour leader.

 

[Jerry]

I suppose David Lloyd George was the last Welsh prime minister (the only one so far?) although he was actually born in the north of England, albeit to Welsh parents and he was brought up speaking Welsh. James Callaghan was Welsh by political adoption having served as MP for Cardiff constituencies for over 40 years although he was born in Portsmouth and seems 'English' in all other respects.

Let's hope that if there is another Welsh prime minister he or she doesn't have a world war to contend with as Lloyd George did when he became premier.

Looking to one scenario in the perhaps foreseeable future, if the next general election returned Labour as the biggest party but with no overall majority and the Lib Dems for whatever reason were unable to provide the deciding balance, it may be that a Labour leader would turn to the Scottish Nationalists and Plaid Cymru for support. The Scots Nats would almost certainly demand another independence referendum as their price and PC would probably want more devolution including APD. Now that would be a head scratcher for a Labour leader.

I'm guessing Callaghan was giving that seat because generally most South Wales seats are safe Labour seats though they have lost ground to UKIP and lost Gower to the tories. Plaid Cymru don't seem to have gained much ground in South Wales apart from Rhondda because Leanne Wood is a local girl.
I don't think any prospective government would allow another referendum for Scotland but full devolution for Wales would be something that a labour government would be willing to give. Though i do wonder if Wales ever gets full devolution which i'm assuming would include taxes like Corporation tax and APD how much it would actually effect the Bristol and South West area and Merseyside and Manchester area. Personally I think the effect wouldn't be that much even if APD was devolved i don't think it would have that much of an effect. Easyjet i can't see moving maybe Ryanair would setup a base but that would just serve the welsh market and i can't see them basing over 2 planes. Maybe CWL would get the odd long haul but that's about it i think.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Getting slightly away from the subject but it would still affect CWL so it's valid, I wonder how much support there is in Wales for full devolution. The Blair government was the driver for the Assembly (it was in their 1997 election-winning manifesto) and in the 1997 referendum just over 50% voted in favour, a majority of fewer than 7,000 votes.

Since then more powers have been devolved and the process continues.

 

[Jerry]

Getting slightly away from the subject but it would still affect CWL so it's valid, I wonder how much support there is in Wales for full devolution. The Blair government was the driver for the Assembly (it was in their 1997 election-winning manifesto) and in the 1997 referendum just over 50% voted in favour, a majority of fewer than 7,000 votes.

Since then more powers have been devolved and the process continues.

I honestly don't know. Us welsh are very patriotic when it comes to sport but not so when it comes to politics! I always thought that if we were as patriotic in politics as sport we'd be independent by know! Honestly i wouldn't be surprised if their was a referendum about the assembly tomorrow that it would be voted out of existence! Let alone given new powers. Politically i think Wales is a bit confused right now hence the rise of UKIP in Wales.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I honestly don't know. Us welsh are very patriotic when it comes to sport but not so when it comes to politics! I always thought that if we were as patriotic in politics as sport we'd be independent by know! Honestly i wouldn't be surprised if their was a referendum about the assembly tomorrow that it would be voted out of existence! Let alone given new powers. Politically i think Wales is a bit confused right now hence the rise of UKIP in Wales.

With the Wales Assembly referendum and the Scottish independence referendum it's only people on the electoral roll that have a vote. This means that Welsh people living outside Wales didn't get a vote on the Assembly but non-Welsh people living in Wales on the electoral roll did. Ditto Scotland with their referendum.

So when the result is close as it was with the Assembly referendum it's impossible to know who may have swung the vote.

 

[Jerry]

With the Wales Assembly referendum and the Scottish independence referendum it's only people on the electoral roll that have a vote. This means that Welsh people living outside Wales didn't get a vote on the Assembly but non-Welsh people living in Wales on the electoral roll did. Ditto Scotland with their referendum.

So when the result is close as it was with the Assembly referendum it's impossible to know who may have swung the vote.

I never thought of that.

 

[Jerry]

Read in Wales Online today that the Welsh government will not be putting forward a bid for the 2026 Commonwealth games. They have blamed Brexit and budgetary concerns. Personally i'm sad about this as it would have benefited the whole of Wales (if a bid had been successful) and also would benefited CWL as people from around the world and the UK would have flown in to watch the games.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Read in Wales Online today that the Welsh government will not be putting forward a bid for the 2026 Commonwealth games. They have blamed Brexit and budgetary concerns. Personally i'm sad about this as it would have benefited the whole of Wales (if a bid had been successful) and also would benefited CWL as people from around the world and the UK would have flown in to watch the games.

That's a pity. It seems to me that too many organisations are blaming Brexit. It's a convenient cop-out in many cases.

Cardiff held the Games in 1958 when they were called the Empire and Commonwealth Games. I was at school at Weston-super-Mare at the time and I went over with a school party to watch the events that day. It included the marathon where the course was from Cardiff towards Newport and back with the finish at Cardiff Arms Park where all the track and field events were held.

We sailed across to Cardiff from the 'Old Pier' (Birnbeck Pier) at Weston, now sadly a derelict despite plans surfacing at regular intervals to restore it to its former glory. Naturally we used one of P and A Campbell's White Funnel Fleet vessels. This fleet of paddle steamers was a feature of the Bristol Channel ports for many, many years until the 1970s with the main boats after the war being Bristol Queen and Cardiff Queen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PS_Br..._Camel_Estuary_-_geograph.org.uk_-_154887.jpg

Sorry for the thread drift.

 

[Jerry]

That's a pity. It seems to me that too many organisations are blaming Brexit. It's a convenient cop-out in many cases.

Cardiff held the Games in 1958 when they were called the Empire and Commonwealth Games. I was at school at Weston-super-Mare at the time and I went over with a school party to watch the events that day. It included the marathon where the course was from Cardiff towards Newport and back with the finish at Cardiff Arms Park where all the track and field events were held.

We sailed across to Cardiff from the 'Old Pier' (Birnbeck Pier) at Weston, now sadly a derelict despite plans surfacing at regular intervals to restore it to its former glory. Naturally we used one of P and A Campbell's White Funnel Fleet vessels. This fleet of paddle steamers was a feature of the Bristol Channel ports for many, many years until the 1970s with the main boats after the war being Bristol Queen and Cardiff Queen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PS_Br..._Camel_Estuary_-_geograph.org.uk_-_154887.jpg

Sorry for the thread drift.

It would have been great! Wales is good at sporting events! The ferry's across the Bristol channel are a bit before my time but i'm surprised no one has tried them again as a tourist thing even just in the summer.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

It would have been great! Wales is good at sporting events! The ferry's across the Bristol channel are a bit before my time but i'm surprised no one has tried them again as a tourist thing even just in the summer.

They have and have done for many years.

The Waverley is a Scotland-based paddle steamer, reminiscent of P & A Campbell's White Funnel Fleet, and only comes to the Bristol Channel for a very short season each year; in 2016 it will be in September.

http://www.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/plan-your-trip/bristol-channel/timetable/

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/BC-2016.pdf

The MV Balmoral is not a paddle steamer - she was originally an Isle of Wight ferry - but cruises the Bristol Channel every summer. She spends the winter moored at Bristol Harbourside (the old City Docks) and in recent years has undergone an extensive refit thanks to lottery and other grants which meant she was taken out of service for two or three years but is now back sailing.

https://www.whitefunnel.co.uk/c-24-bristol-channel.aspx

 

[Jerry]

They have and have done for many years.

The Waverley is a Scotland-based paddle steamer, reminiscent of P & A Campbell's White Funnel Fleet and only comes to the Bristol Channel for a very short season each year, in 2016 it will be in September.

http://www.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/plan-your-trip/bristol-channel/timetable/

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/BC-2016.pdf

The MV Balmoral is not a paddle steamer - it was originally an Isle of Wight ferry - but cruises the Bristol Channel every summer. It spends the winter moored at Bristol Harbourside( the old City Docks) and in recent years has undergone an extensive refit thanks to lottery and other grants.

https://www.whitefunnel.co.uk/c-24-bristol-channel.aspx

I never knew that! I might have a look at that.

 

[superking]

you are getting as bad as me jim with thread drifts. i also went on the paddle queens also the glen usk.the balmoral is down in southampton at the moment doing cruises from various points. sorry for the drift.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

you are getting as bad as me jim with thread drifts. i also went on the paddle queens also the glen usk.the balmoral is down in southampton at the moment doing cruises from various points. sorry for the drift.

We aren't too sniffy about a bit of thread drift, unlike one one fruity aviation message board I could name.

We can always drift back to the original thread with a bit of imagination. The channel cruisers pass quite close to CWL at times and passengers might see aircraft flying in or out overhead and make them think they might use the airport in the future. How about that?

 

[Jerry]

We aren't too sniffy about a bit of thread drift, unlike one one fruity aviation message board I could name.

We can always drift back to the original thread with a bit of imagination. The channel cruisers pass quite close to CWL at times and passengers might see aircraft flying in or out overhead and make them think they might use the airport in the future. How about that?

I did read a news article about cruises starting from Cardiff docks next year. Hopefully that will mean some passengers might use CWL! I'm hoping i'll be near Cardiff when the ships are in port so I get some photos.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I did read a news article about cruises starting from Cardiff docks next year. Hopefully that will mean some passengers might use CWL! I'm hoping i'll be near Cardiff when the ships are in port so I get some photos.

That will be a good, extra attraction for the area. I've looked on the Associated British Ports website, Port of Cardiff section, but there is little about the cruises shown. ABP's main site lists its ports that offer cruises but it concentrates on Southampton.

So there is nothing that tells people from outside the area how they might reach the port such as by flying in to CWL.

The Bristol Port Company, not part of ABP, on the other hand has a detailed section on its website on cruises from there including ways of reaching Avonmouth from Bristol Airport and from Temple Meads railway station. The main cruise company that uses Avonmouth is Cruise & Maritime, the company that will use Cardiff and Newport next year. Fred Olsen also used Avonmouth for the past couple of years but doesn't seem to be back for 2017.

I have no idea how many people use BRS for Avonmouth cruises so I can't hazard a guess how well CWL will be patronised by the cruising community travelling to the Port of Cardiff. What I do know is that CWL has always done very well with cruise flights to the likes of the West Indies so there is certainly a cruise market in South Wales, albeit I do know that some of those on the CWL transatlantic cruise flights come from outside South Wales.

Nevertheless, a bit of liaison between the CWL press people and the Port of Cardiff and Cruise & Maritime could be a useful exercise.

 

[Jerry]

That will be a good, extra attraction for the area. I've looked on the Associated British Ports website, Port of Cardiff section, but there is little about the cruises shown. ABP's main site lists its ports that offer cruises but it concentrates on Southampton.

So there is nothing that tells people from outside the area how they might reach the port such as by flying in to CWL.

The Bristol Port Company, not part of ABP, on the other hand has a detailed section on its website on cruises from there including ways of reaching Avonmouth from Bristol Airport and from Temple Meads railway station. The main cruise company that uses Avonmouth is Cruise & Maritime, the company that will use Cardiff and Newport next year. Fred Olsen also used Avonmouth for the past couple of years but doesn't seem to be back for 2017.

I have no idea how many people use BRS for Avonmouth cruises so I can't hazard a guess how well CWL will be patronised by the cruising community travelling to the Port of Cardiff. What I do know is that CWL has always done very well with cruise flights to the likes of the West Indies so there is certainly a cruise market in South Wales, albeit I do know that some of those on the CWL transatlantic cruise flights come from outside South Wales.

Nevertheless, a bit of liaison between the CWL press people and the Port of Cardiff and Cruise & Maritime could be a useful exercise.

There was an article on BBC news and I think Wales Online did one. As someone who has been on a med cruise I was quite surprised how many of my fellow Welsh people were on it! Cruising i think is more popular than people think and I think more cruise flights from CWL would be a success I believe. If these cruises become regular hopefully a link up with the airport will happen to promote them.

 

[Jerry]

Was looking on an air forum dedicated to wales earlier on and I saw a post about the Citwing Anglesey service. The Citywing contract runs out in September as it was only a temporary 7 month contract because Links Air lost its safety certificate. The WAG has put it out to tender for a 4 year contract. I don't know if Citywing will bid for the contract or who would be likely to bid for it. I am wondering though if Flybe via a franchise partner like Loganair would consider it and also do flights to other UK regional airports like say LBA? Using a 30 seater aircraft as i wouldn't see a Q400 working on that route.