Infrastructure, Construction & Developments

[Brum X]

We have made a planner out of you coathanger. Well done.

I would also expand the old eruohub and put the forgotten remote pier in unless it restricts the larger aircraft movements. All very much needed and needed sooner than the airport seem to be currently planning for. My preference is this kind of expansion than the new HS2 hub approach.

How about a big terminal like Barcelona El Prat which may not be possible on the existing constrained site, I would defo favour the HS2 option as long as it was a quality terminal.

 

[Coathanger16]

Interesting points raised by all.

Eurohub - I would of course replace it, but that was too much work to add to the plan, hence why its still there.

I think the future of BHX will very much depend on whether or not the airport stays at the current site or moves to the HS2 site. I don't think a split operation would work too well.

The current site (including the surface car parks) allows for an almost doubling of size of the terminal complex, and Gatwick proves just how many movements you can get off a single runway.

However, at some point the existing site will reach capacity. By that point, the HS2 'Interchange' Station will have been built along with the Arden Cross development, so unless that land is safeguarded for future expansion (unlikely given the potential of the site with HS2 coming), expansion will have to take place elsewhere.

Didn't someone say on SSC that the master plan was imminent? Couldn't BHX coincide the launch of the master plan with the August passenger figures, likely highlighting BHX 30th consecutive month of growth. Announcing a new CEO at the same time would make it an even bigger news day for BHX and would certainly turn heads.

 

[58terminus]

There is/was talk that Midland Metro will extend from the airport to HS2.

Even if Midland Metro started laying the route tomorrow only the youngest on here would see it completed.A new terminal and other infrastructure will have been long built before they have reached Sheldon.I think they average about 1 mile every 5 years

 

[jfy1999]

A random thought which I don't know if anyone has noticed before: Paul Kehoe was talking about the runway extension and mentioned that a fully loaded A321neo would have had trouble getting to Egypt off the old runway length - so the runway extension is coming into its own now Primera are flying the A321neo across the pond...

 

[Jerry]

A random thought which I don't know if anyone has noticed before: Paul Kehoe was talking about the runway extension and mentioned that a fully loaded A321neo would have had trouble getting to Egypt off the old runway length - so the runway extension is coming into its own now Primera are flying the A321neo across the pond...

What was the length of the old runway?

 

[rollo]

Used to be 2600m which I would have thought allows the A321 to operate pretty much without any (or even completely) restrictions, maybe PK was just stretching a point to help justify the 400m extension.

Edit.
Just looked up the figures and take off distance given as 2560m at sea level so given BHX is 300+ feet above sea level PK would have been just about correct.

 

[Barry Beeth]

I've read elsewhere that a 321 to Banjul needs the extension, so the same would apply t/a, performance differences between old and new models notwithstanding, of course.

 

[IanFarquharson]

Just popped down to BHX to see how the hotel was progressing - not much change from a few weeks ago !
Parked the car in Clock Lane and came back to a £35 parking ticket.
My fault, it is double yellow but normally ok at the weekend.

 

[JF57]

Just popped down to BHX to see how the hotel was progressing - not much change from a few weeks ago !
Parked the car in Clock Lane and came back to a £35 parking ticket.
My fault, it is double yellow but normally ok at the weekend.

Ouch! Dare not like original post as it could give the wrong impression!

 

[nbdm]

Hi, new poster to the forum here but I felt I needed to register and voice my opinions on a few things, after reading some recent posts.

I fully agree with others about BHX losing out to the likes of Manchester, I myself am going to be flying out of MAN instead of BHX next week for two reasons: cost (flights much cheaper from there) and choice (there are a lot more routes to choose from)
We as a family have done this several times (eg. Kangaroo route to Australia or to USA, flying from LHR) and it is mostly down to cost. However earlier this year we flew with EK from BHX and had a decent experience, even the bags were offloaded in good time, this could be because of the time of year, but one thing is for sure, the security queues are horrendous.

I also fully agree that BHX is in dire need of some upgrades, I attended one of the meetings for the flight path changes as it affects the area, I was talking to one of the representatives about the situation I described above, they responded by more or less saying "well, we have EK and QR", to which I gave them another example of where we have had to fly out of another airport - for numerous reasons, again cost and route choice.
Personally I think BHX would benefit from SQ/Scoot, EY and a far east carrier such as CX but this has been discussed elsewhere and I don't hold out much hope. I also don't anticipate any chance of VS or DL coming to BHX as this would unfortunately impede on their traffic to their other UK bases.

With regards to Primera Air, I think the tight-lipped fourth destination could be one of their Scandinavian hubs rather than anything in North America (aside from Toronto)

With the prospect of HS2 coming in the next couple of decades I asked what are the chances of a second runway being built as HS2 will be going on one of the pieces of land that could've been used for a second runway. They replied by assuring me (probably thinking I was against expansion) that there wouldn't be another runway built. Period.

As others have also said, it will be interesting to see what the much anticipated and delayed masterplan contains and if any of it will be deliverable within a decent timeframe. If HS2 isn't a key part of it then they are missing a trick. As for the UGC (Urban Growth Company) / Arden Cross proposal I think it should be completely binned with the land safeguarded for future expansion, I have plenty to say on that subject but don't want to go off topic

Personally one of the things that puts me off BHX the most is the atmosphere, it feels very dark especially in the main departure lounge, due to there being no natural light and the roof height, the international pier is ok, but not many amenities leads to most people staying in the main area.

For all it's shortcomings I think BHX has improved massively over the last few years but hasn't had the kind of investment needed. Spending a fortune changing the pick-up/drop-off arrangements is clearly a commercial decision and shouldn't be treated as a real upgrade.

Sorry if I have rambled on slightly and gone off-topic at all!

 

[JF57]

Hi, new poster to the forum here but I felt I needed to register and voice my opinions on a few things, after reading some recent posts.

I fully agree with others about BHX losing out to the likes of Manchester, I myself am going to be flying out of MAN instead of BHX next week for two reasons: cost (flights much cheaper from there) and choice (there are a lot more routes to choose from)
We as a family have done this several times (eg. Kangaroo route to Australia or to USA, flying from LHR) and it is mostly down to cost. However earlier this year we flew with EK from BHX and had a decent experience, even the bags were offloaded in good time, this could be because of the time of year, but one thing is for sure, the security queues are horrendous.

I also fully agree that BHX is in dire need of some upgrades, I attended one of the meetings for the flight path changes as it affects the area, I was talking to one of the representatives about the situation I described above, they responded by more or less saying "well, we have EK and QR", to which I gave them another example of where we have had to fly out of another airport - for numerous reasons, again cost and route choice.
Personally I think BHX would benefit from SQ/Scoot, EY and a far east carrier such as CX but this has been discussed elsewhere and I don't hold out much hope. I also don't anticipate any chance of VS or DL coming to BHX as this would unfortunately impede on their traffic to their other UK bases.

With regards to Primera Air, I think the tight-lipped fourth destination could be one of their Scandinavian hubs rather than anything in North America (aside from Toronto)

With the prospect of HS2 coming in the next couple of decades I asked what are the chances of a second runway being built as HS2 will be going on one of the pieces of land that could've been used for a second runway. They replied by assuring me (probably thinking I was against expansion) that there wouldn't be another runway built. Period.

As others have also said, it will be interesting to see what the much anticipated and delayed masterplan contains and if any of it will be deliverable within a decent timeframe. If HS2 isn't a key part of it then they are missing a trick. As for the UGC (Urban Growth Company) / Arden Cross proposal I think it should be completely binned with the land safeguarded for future expansion, I have plenty to say on that subject but don't want to go off topic

Personally one of the things that puts me off BHX the most is the atmosphere, it feels very dark especially in the main departure lounge, due to there being no natural light and the roof height, the international pier is ok, but not many amenities leads to most people staying in the main area.

For all it's shortcomings I think BHX has improved massively over the last few years but hasn't had the kind of investment needed. Spending a fortune changing the pick-up/drop-off arrangements is clearly a commercial decision and shouldn't be treated as a real upgrade.

Sorry if I have rambled on slightly and gone off-topic at all!

Welcome. You make some interesting points.

The departure lounge is dark as you say and does not have enough seating. Not only is the international pier lighter but it has acres of unused space. We would be quite happy to move through to there once we have eaten / shopped but until the gate comes up it is not clear where to go. Some airline always us the same gate (Emirates, for example) but that is not accessible until opened by staff.

We have not experienced security problem and our bag return times have been better of late than they were a couple of years ago. Perhaps just timing?

I think the terminal needs improving before a second runway is required when you see what Gatwick can do.

Proximity to LHR and MAN will never go away it is a fact of life so that will hinder expansion.

Time will tell particularly with Brexit coming. The master plan and a new CEO would help

 

[megaark-1]

The new (well not so new now) pier is great. Light and airy, a really nice place to be. The main departure lounge is the complete opposite: dark, cramped, and overcrowded. It's quite unpleasant. I've always wondered why the airport don't add more retail and catering to the pier, to encourage greater movement around the terminal. It seems like an awful underutilisation of space. I always head for the pier to wait for my flight but if others were encouraged to do so then the whole experience might be more pleasant.

I recently flew out of the old eurohub. As I waited for my flight I couldn't help but notice how quiet it was. It was absolutely dead. Whilst the main lounge I had left behind me was full to brimming over. It would require some internal reconstruction but widening the corridor linking the two areas and encouraging movement would again make for a better experience. Put up plenty of departure boards with walking times to gates (they do that at proper airports, right?) and no one will miss their flights!

 

[Brum X]

Welcome to the Forum nbdm

 

[Ray Finkle]

Hi, new poster to the forum here

Welcome to the forum, great first post. I hope you stick with us and make many more

 

[Jon Dempsey]

The new (well not so new now) pier is great. Light and airy, a really nice place to be. The main departure lounge is the complete opposite: dark, cramped, and overcrowded. It's quite unpleasant. I've always wondered why the airport don't add more retail and catering to the pier, to encourage greater movement around the terminal. It seems like an awful underutilisation of space. I always head for the pier to wait for my flight but if others were encouraged to do so then the whole experience might be more pleasant.

I recently flew out of the old eurohub. As I waited for my flight I couldn't help but notice how quiet it was. It was absolutely dead. Whilst the main lounge I had left behind me was full to brimming over. It would require some internal reconstruction but widening the corridor linking the two areas and encouraging movement would again make for a better experience. Put up plenty of departure boards with walking times to gates (they do that at proper airports, right?) and no one will miss their flights!

I've often noticed that, unless you're in one of the rush hours, T2 is very quiet.

Perhaps a cheap solution to congestion would be to revamp the border area and baggage reclaim in order to shift a couple of carriers over there.

Obviously requires a CEO before these things can be instigated!

 

[Ianbutty]

Welcome nbdm. Nice to have you here.

The capacity and general feel of the airport is a hot topic. A master plan is expected soon...probably waiting for the new CEO first...and we will get a glimpse of what might be. However if growth continues at the current rate time will run out fast. Given where BHX site geographically we cannot afford a sloppy cramped in efficient airport.

I went to alicante for the first time eearlier this year. The single huge terminal is what we need to consider. Question is how on such a constrained site. A second terminal on the Elmdon side would help create capacity to carry out significant reshaping of the terminal site. Wilst the new hotels on the terminal site show confidence they have restricted significantly whingt can be achieved there.

As for the HS2 proposal unless it comes with a new runway (or two) and effectively creating a new airport, I cannot see that happening. If that was to happen you can close the existing airport over time and just think of the scope to redevelop that?

 

[Ray Finkle]

It's quite unpleasant. I've always wondered why the airport don't add more retail and catering to the pier, to encourage greater movement around the terminal.

I've also wondered the same, if they added a restaurant or bar giving views across the apron I'm sure it would be extremely popular.

I also don't understand why the wasted area in front of Frankie & Benny's hasn't been taken up for a departure lounge extension. It pretty much serves no purpose at the moment, all that's needed upstairs is a corridor to security.

 

[JF57]

I've also wondered the same, if they added a restaurant or bar giving views across the apron I'm sure it would be extremely popular.

I also don't understand why the wasted area in front of Frankie & Benny's hasn't been taken up for a departure lounge extension. It pretty much serves no purpose at the moment, all that's needed upstairs is a corridor to security.

The area around F & B is interesting. If you arrive before check in opens then there is not a lot of space downstairs to wait and have a drink. One option would be to go upstairs but the whole area is not required for this - it is much too large.

More room is required at arrivals. It is often solid round there. Again if you arrive early to pick someone up and you want a drink you might end up going upstairs round F & B.

The other issue with the arrivals area is it is a corridor for those who enter the building at the opposite end to their check in desk.

Hopefully the master plan will address all of these issues. The recent expenditure was supposed to make things better but still some way to go and with passenger numbers increasing rapidly we need some effective measures before too long.

 

[Ray Finkle]

With the closure of the service road directly in front of the buildings I've often thought that the glass frontage of arrivals could be bought forward to utilise this space more effectively.

 

[IanFarquharson]

With the closure of the service road directly in front of the buildings I've often thought that the glass frontage of arrivals could be bought forward to utilise this space more effectively.

But the road is next to the terminal again and a potential risk of a terroist attack.