Airport Consultative Committee [Questions & Responses]

[Len Fish]

LBA Parkway Station

Being supported now by Tracey Brabin.

Only because she thinks it’s a bus station!

 

[Jetchaser]

A brilliant report WH...thanks for giving us the lowdown on developments. From your report I see LBA reaching for the skies moving forward! Roll on 2026.

 

[SierraHotel]

Thank you WH for your dedication to this forum. Greatly appreciated.

 

[Finger66]

The usual amazing report @White Heather. Thank you for your on going time and effort in compiling these reports

 

[AndyL]

Many thanks for an excellent report. Things seem to be very positive at LBA and hoping for a good 2025

 

[Aviador]

Only because she thinks it’s a bus station!

Thank you @White Heather for your time and effort compiling your report. It's much appreciated.

@Len Fish You might be onto something there, have we mist a trick. Should we be calling it Leeds Bradford Station?

 

[GolfFox]

Many thanks WH - most informative!

 

[BCFC]

Thanks WH….as always an excellent report, it if does happen LHR would be nice on an A319 but at the end of the day an ATR will do

 

[LBAYORKIE]

An ATR72 would be ideal if based at LBA as it would already be on the apron first thing, departures first thing in the morning generally have no issues, its the inbounds that suffer esp winter months due to fog, low cloud etc
A 3 daily ops should work well esp on the larger atr72 and with the more respectable loganair brand, i hope something comes of this, plus it would be great to get a few more domestic routes back on the dep boards from the carrier!
Thanks wh for your notes, the airport seems to be in a good strong position overall with positive signs, i feel as the months pass and the regen continues news will only get better!

Its not just their low viz capability, they are poor in crosswinds too. We see quite a few of Aer Lingus diversions for these reasons. Just an observation.

 

[Bigman]

Only because she thinks it’s a bus station!

You mean airbus station

 

[Finger66]

Its not just their low viz capability, they are poor in crosswinds too. We see quite a few of Aer Lingus diversions for these reasons. Just an observation.

One consideration I would throw in here is whether LM pilots are trained to a higher level of extreme weather. After all Scotland is fairly prone to that.
All that said of course there will still be operational limitations on the aircraft itself.
I am sure LM (and BA) will take that all into consideration as part of the risk assessment before committing.
An AT72 3 daily with a BA code-share most definitely better than nothing service at all

 

[LBAYORKIE]

One consideration I would throw in here is whether LM pilots are trained to a higher level of extreme weather. After all Scotland is fairly prone to that.
All that said of course there will still be operational limitations on the aircraft itself.
I am sure LM (and BA) will take that all into consideration as part of the risk assessment before committing.
An AT72 3 daily with a BA code-share most definitely better than nothing service at all

I just didnt want to see another 'false start'. Pax are soon going to suss out reliability of the service.

BA must be relatively confident but ultimately if cancellations and diversions are due to weather they dont have to pay compensation.

If aircraft go tech do Loganair have a big enough fleet to send a substitute aircraft? I suppose same question applies to Eastern when they replace KLM.

 

[Finger66]

Way of the world for continuation of regional air services I am afraid. The LCC's have done a great job in opening up flying to the masses, but that's been at the expense of legacy carriers having to cut their own costs to the bone to compete. So whilst KL have aircraft issues they are also looking for cost savings. LM are unfortunately not going to have spare AT72s sitting around. What we really need there is a 2nd based one doing other routes that may then help provide back-up prioritisation

 

[LBA4EVER]

Also bare in mind where our current aer lingus ATRs fly to, its not just a leeds thing, Dublin has its good share of windy weather and its the same with belfast and a shorter runway, yet loads are very healthy on these services.

 

[Finger66]

Absolutely. If an AT72 was completely unsuited to LBA we wouldn't have any operating. Overall diversion rate remains relatively low

 

[752]

Today was the latest LBA Consultative Meeting and so here are the key points discussed today. Please, as ever, dont shoot the messenger.

* Passenger figures.

LBA passenger figures are the highest in the history of the airport. From w/e 7th April 2024 to w/e 24th November, (34 weeks) a total of 3,313,330 passengers used LBA. LBA are expecting the final total for the fiscal year to be in the region of 4,350,000.

* Public Relations.

Joselyn Rankin has now commenced work as LBAs Public Relations Director and gave a presentation on her plans to address various issues, including the airport's relationship with journalists/publications, and how the airport publicly responds to claims made by groups such as they who shall not be named which are often misleading , and inaccurate. It is now accepted that LBA needs to do more to put forward the position of the airport and to counter inaccurate claims and reporting through various means. The current external PR consultants will be handing over all LBA related work in the near future when their contract ends.

* Aviation Director

Nicola McMullen, the Aviation Director has left LBA for 'family reasons' and her replacement will be recruited , but in the meantime, the CEO, Vincent Hodder, is stepping in to perform this work alongside his own, with several changes within the airport senior management to enable the necessary support.

* National Airports Consultative Committee

For the first time in many years, the recent meeting of national ACCs was hosted at LBA over two days. This was well received and attended by 15 other airports. All were provided with a tour of the airport and it's developments and all were very impressed.

* Track Keeping.

Runway 32 was used 70% of the time over the summer months and runway 14 30%. Departures on runway 32 saw between 94% and 98% of aircraft remain within the NPR. The variance was caused by A320 aircraft of both Wizz and easyJet, and the reasons, which relate to the aircraft rather than any fault of the crew, are being investigated .
Departures on 14 saw almost 100% compliance across the summer.

* Noise

Independent monitoring and reporting has shown that whilst LBA is busier than in 2016, noise exposure has reduced with a significant reduction in noise levels and the numbers exposed to it.

Across the summer, only 1 aircraft breached noise limits on departure (Ryanair). Just 3 did so on arrival, all Jet2. These breaches are all subject to investigation and no particular reason for the (slight) exceedance is known. All breaches were at night.

Noise complaints reduced this summer to 132 in total from 54 people, the majority being in the Headingley/West Park/Weetwood areas of Leeds (They who shall not be named HQ?), Menston, and Otley. August and September saw 27 complaints from only 10 people in August and 16 in September.

LBA confirmed it is still incentivising airlines to operate QC0.25 aircraft from LBA with reduced fees.

*LBA Regen

All steelwork and floors and roof completed except the link at the Eastern end which is not yet constructed. Cladding is 90% completed. Interior works now progressing well and the terminal extension remains in track for completion April 2025, and being put into use in May 2025.

Confirmed that around February/March 2025, two additional aircraft stands will be built, with a further two each year up to a maximum of 10.

*. CEO update including Airline news

Full year profit expected of £20m, with this necessarily rising year on year to fund developments . (Total £200m).

Government have increased the LBA Business rate by 600% to £4.5m. One major airport now has rates to pay in excess if their annual wage bill. Stated that airports will be 'having words' with Government and that some airports will not survive such increases.

New staff car park being built on site of old catering facility (near roundabout and tunnel entrance). Staff cars will then no longer be parked within public areas.

By March 2025, all airport owned light vehicles will be electric with current petrol and diesel vehicles disposed of. The airport is examining options for solar power and the installation of EV charging across the estate. All Gas to be removed from airport buildings too.

The hearing into the CLEUD appeals will take place at Leeds Civic Hall between 11th and 14th March 2025. A decision is expected by late June. If the decision favours the Council and if LBA are satisfied the legal matters have been addressed properly, they will 'walk away' and consider their options, including lodging a planning application. If the decision favours the Council and the airport consider the decision fails to address legal matters or is politically influenced, they will take the matter to the High Court.

If Leeds City Council choose to issue an Enforcement Notice for breach of night flying for summer 2024, LBA will appeal to the County Court. LBA take the view that such action is inappropriate when the planning consent the council allege is breached, is the subject of an appeal. They believe any enforcement action should be held back and issued only after any final decision on the CLEUDs in the Councils favour. However, the CEO is satisfied LBA have a very strong case and would not be pursuing it were that not the case.

KLM - have now confirmed that from the summer 2025 season, until further notice but on a temporary basis, all LBA-AMS flights will be operated by Eastern E190s. This is due to fleet shortages arising at KLM due to the grounding of many of their E190-2s which have the same engine issues that Wizz have with their NEOs. LBA have held discussions with KLM regarding ensuring that the service remains reliable. On the plus side, the 3x daily E190 represents a seat capacity increase over that KLM could offer using their mix of E190 & 175 types.

Jet2. - confirmed their 15th aircraft will operate W legs into LTN but the intention is that from 2026 it will be 100% operating at LBA.

easyJet now very content to look at growth at LBA in the coming years and LBAs relationship with them was described as 'strong'.

Ryanair and Wizz also continue to have good relationship with LBA and both are very happy with their performance here.

Loganair - the meeting went ahead with their CEO, and went very well. There have been further discussions since and their is much optimism. Loganair have held discussions with BA over slots at LHR and the Loganair board will make any final decisions as to if, and when, they may come to LBA. If they do, LHR would be a 3 times daily ATR72, based here, with further route options in the future including Southampton, Aberdeen, Newquay and Glasgow.

Other airline opportunities, based on the A321XLR remain on the agenda but unlikely before 2027, no doubt due to the slow rollout of new aircraft from Airbus and the need to complete LBA Regen too.

LBA Parkway Station

Being supported now by Tracey Brabin. (No kidding!) . Still with the WYCA to finalise the business case but they want to get the costs down through less emphasis on architectural delights and more on just doing the job.

That's all folks.

What worries me is LBA was admiement they wasnt aware Eastern wasnt taking over the AMS service. This season we have Sunday flight, next Summer all flights...

the rumours was there / people could see what was happening.

makes me worried about the Wizz rumour. adamant they are happy / doing well. Hopefully its not smoke and mirrors. Also someone posted 166 on A321 From GDN with Wizz, not the best of loads.

 

[LBAYORKIE]

What worries me is LBA was admiement they wasnt aware Eastern wasnt taking over the AMS service. This season we have Sunday flight, next Summer all flights...

the rumours was there / people could see what was happening.

makes me worried about the Wizz rumour. adamant they are happy / doing well. Hopefully its not smoke and mirrors. Also someone posted 166 on A321 From GDN with Wizz, not the best of loads.

The airline business is very unpredictable. Often airports are told what they want to hear by airlines. Ive seen many instances over the years of airlines saying one thing and planning another.

 

[White Heather]

What worries me is LBA was admiement they wasnt aware Eastern wasnt taking over the AMS service. This season we have Sunday flight, next Summer all flights...

the rumours was there / people could see what was happening.

makes me worried about the Wizz rumour. adamant they are happy / doing well. Hopefully its not smoke and mirrors. Also someone posted 166 on A321 From GDN with Wizz, not the best if loads

LBA were adamant at the time because then (3 months ago) KLM had not approached them about a switch to Eastern. They can't report what they dont know about. It's not as though LBA is alone having Eastern is it? They're turning up at most airports now. We will be well behind many in that regard. Eastern even did some flights to MAN last summer .

As for Wizz, well with Christmas a couple of weeks away I would imagine loads on some routes would be slightly down right now, with people waiting until just before Christmas to travel and spend Christmas with family etc. I watched a Buzz flight leave for a Polish destination yesterday and that too seemed light, with take off only half way down 32.
I asked the CEO (after the meeting).about the 'rumour'. He laughed, and said it goes on all the time and he would be surprised if MAN were not trying to poach Wizz from LPL and LBA, but he simply reiterated that Wizz are happy, came to LBA by choice because this is where their customers are, and that he's had nothing to indicate they may pack up and go to MAN. He did say though that if they did then Ryanair would be quick to pick up the capacity - which of course Wizz are aware of. Their customers are unlikely to follow them to MAN if Ryanair are available on the same routes from LBA, particularly if there's little price difference.

 

[LBAYORKIE]

LBA were adamant at the time because then (3 months ago) KLM had not approached them about a switch to Eastern. They can't report what they dont know about. It's not as though LBA is alone having Eastern is it? They're turning up at most airports now. We will be well behind many in that regard. Eastern even did some flights to MAN last summer .

As for Wizz, well with Christmas a couple of weeks away I would imagine loads on some routes would be slightly down right now, with people waiting until just before Christmas to travel and spend Christmas with family etc. I watched a Buzz flight leave for a Polish destination yesterday and that too seemed light, with take off only half way down 32.
I asked the CEO (after the meeting).about the 'rumour'. He laughed, and said it goes on all the time and he would be surprised if MAN were not trying to poach Wizz from LPL and LBA, but he simply reiterated that Wizz are happy, came to LBA by choice because this is where their customers are, and that he's had nothing to indicate they may pack up and go to MAN. He did say though that if they did then Ryanair would be quick to pick up the capacity - which of course Wizz are aware of. Their customers are unlikely to follow them to MAN if Ryanair are available on the same routes from LBA, particularly if there's little price difference.

Thats reassuring. Its important that the airport are aware of the rumours, keeps them on their toes!

 

[White Heather]

Thats reassuring. Its important that the airport are aware of the rumours, keeps them on their toes!

Yes, that's why I made a point of telling him what has been reported on here by one member. Fact is though that if an airline is planning something like a move elsewhere, the airport they are planning on leaving will only find out when the airline tells them they're off or demand better terms to stay. I'm sure Wizz signed a contract with LBA too in 2022 so leaving could be expensive if that's still in force - although it didn't stop TUi a few years ago.

Frankly, leaving LPL would be a surprise given how long Wizz have flown there and their relationship with Peel. And just leaving LBA to operate at both MAN and LPL, makes little sense as they'd effectively be giving up the entire market East of the Pennines to Ryanair.