Airport seeks legal clarification on night flying

[Len Fish]

It would seem so and this retrospective enforcement notice in respect of QC1 aircraft is now pretty academic and a waste of taxpayers money by an already cash strapped Council . Maybe LCC are holding off issuing an enforcement notice for other night flights by quieter aircraft as this will be covered in the appeals made by LBA that night flight restrictions do not apply to these aircraft. As I’ve said before the whole thing is a complete mess due to LCCs own incompetence aided and abetted by that minority group we can’t mention.

 

[LBAYORKIE]

It would seem so and this retrospective enforcement notice in respect of QC1 aircraft is now pretty academic and a waste of taxpayers money by an already cash strapped Council . Maybe LCC are holding off issuing an enforcement notice for other night flights by quieter aircraft as this will be covered in the appeals made by LBA that night flight restrictions do not apply to these aircraft. As I’ve said before the whole thing is a complete mess due to LCCs own incompetence aided and abetted by that minority group we can’t mention.

Could be they're waiting for the result of the final cleud before taking action on further flights.

 

[Statto]

It would seem so and this retrospective enforcement notice in respect of QC1 aircraft is now pretty academic and a waste of taxpayers money by an already cash strapped Council

I don’t think it entails much more than a letter reminding the airport that they are not permitted to allow qc1 rated aircraft to depart between 23:00 and 07:00

 

[White Heather]

Could be they're waiting for the result of the final cleud before taking action on further flights.

LBA expect the final CLEUD to be rejected as LCC seem determined to find a way to wriggle out if the mess they themselves have helped create. As LBA are appealing the CLEUDs and are adamant their interpretation of what is allowed is correct, I can't see them taking much notice of any further enforcement notices, so the Council issuing them makes no sense until the outcome of the appeals is known..

 

[michael]

I don’t think it entails much more than a letter reminding the airport that they are not permitted to allow qc1 rated aircraft to depart between 23:00 and 07:00

I'm no aviation expert but if my reading of all this is correct isn't it just solely Jet2's 733's that are classed as QC1?? I'm guessing in the past possibly the 757's might have been and possibly PIA's A310??
If so, the 757's are all but gone, the A310 is definitely gone and the B733's never in normal circumstances take off after 11pm - with them all being LBA based it's not as if they're positioning to somewhere else over night - so it's only early departures before 7am that break 'the law'. What a set of wazzarks those who can't be mentioned are!!
Hopefully as Max's, Neo's and E290's become more common all this will soon be a thing of the past.

 

[Len Fish]

But LCC don’t seem to accept that the newer, quieter aircraft are exempt from the night time restrictions?

 

[GolfFox]

I'm no aviation expert but if my reading of all this is correct isn't it just solely Jet2's 733's that are classed as QC1?? I'm guessing in the past possibly the 757's might have been and possibly PIA's A310??
If so, the 757's are all but gone, the A310 is definitely gone and the B733's never in normal circumstances take off after 11pm - with them all being LBA based it's not as if they're positioning to somewhere else over night - so it's only early departures before 7am that break 'the law'. What a set of wazzarks those who can't be mentioned are!!
Hopefully as Max's, Neo's and E290's become more common all this will soon be a thing of the past.

757 was only QC0.25 - what an aircraft - 733 is QC0.5 on departure according to the NATS listing used for London Airports so as far as I can see it is not affected on departure!

 

[White Heather]

757 was only QC0.25 - what an aircraft - 733 is QC0.5 on departure according to the NATS listing used for London Airports so as far as I can see it is not affected on departure!

So basically whatever breached the restrictions doesn't operate here any more so there's no impact. It almost seems like the Council are going through the motions by issuing an enforcement order they know won't actually impact on LBA ops. If the 733 isn't QC1 on take off then even the departures between 0600-0700 are ok, although they will if course count towards our annual movement limit.

 

[GolfFox]

So basically whatever breached the restrictions doesn't operate here any more so there's no impact. It almost seems like the Council are going through the motions by issuing an enforcement order they know won't actually impact on LBA ops. If the 733 isn't QC1 on take off then even the departures between 0600-0700 are ok, although they will if course count towards our annual movement limit.

Looks that way!

 

[LBAYORKIE]

This could be one to keep an eye on:

BBC News - Birmingham Airport seeks night flight deal as demand grows - BBC News

Birmingham Airport seeks night flight deal as demand grows

Papers say the airport has seen a rise in low-cost carriers and is handling 40% more passengers.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[White Heather]

This could be one to keep an eye on:

BBC News - Birmingham Airport seeks night flight deal as demand grows - BBC News

Birmingham Airport seeks night flight deal as demand grows

Papers say the airport has seen a rise in low-cost carriers and is handling 40% more passengers.

www.bbc.co.uk

Interesting their limit is percentage based whereas LBA has a strict numerical limit that doesn't change irrespective of how many daytime movements there are . So at BHX, the busier they are during the day, the more night movements they get. No mention either of a winter and summer split.

 

[LBAYORKIE]

Interesting their limit is percentage based whereas LBA has a strict numerical limit that doesn't change irrespective of how many daytime movements there are . So at BHX, the busier they are during the day, the more night movements they get. No mention either of a winter and summer split.

All true, but its all about more flights and how the council will balance commercial and environmental concerns.

 

[White Heather]

All true, but its all about more flights and how the council will balance commercial and environmental concerns.

Or not, as the case may be.

 

[LBAYORKIE]

This is just as anticipated.

BBC News - Airport accused of breaching night flight limits

Leeds Bradford Airport accused of third night flight limit breach

Campaigners say Leeds Bradford Airport breached a summertime cap for the third consecutive year.

www.bbc.com

 

[Bantamzen]

This is just as anticipated.

BBC News - Airport accused of breaching night flight limits

Leeds Bradford Airport accused of third night flight limit breach

Campaigners say Leeds Bradford Airport breached a summertime cap for the third consecutive year.

www.bbc.com

Don't they have anything better to do with their lives? Someone needs to send a support team in to help them find hobbies that will be better use of their time...

 

[HX3]

Hopefully when the CLEUD reviews are completed, the unmentionables will have plenty of time to eat humble pie. The irony is, that their perceived issues (who the vast local public do not share) have become their reality. Imagine having to stay up and record information on their log, when the normal public are sleeping peacefully through the alleged noise. They really do need some help, so they can get on with life

 

[LBAYORKIE]

Hopefully when the CLEUD reviews are completed, the unmentionables will have plenty of time to eat humble pie. The irony is, that their perceived issues (who the vast local public do not share) have become their reality. Imagine having to stay up and record information on their log, when the normal public are sleeping peacefully through the alleged noise. They really do need some help, so they can get on with life

Its remains to be seen who will end up eating humble pie.

 

[Finger66]

My own view is that there are probably rights and wrongs on both sides here so some sort of compromise is needed. If it was that clear cut the council would have prosecuted and LBA are I suspect are exploiting a loophole as a result - i.e. their own interpretation.

In today's legal world everything needs to be watertight for something to stick and it seems pretty clear that things ain't watertight so it all rumbles on with the status quo.

How do I think this will end? As long as QC compliant aircraft used then no breach occurs which is ultimately LBAs interpretation so some sort of redefining will have to happen from the council perspective. So could be a bit of humble pie eating on both sides.

Equally I am not well enough in the know so who actually knows how this will end based on LCCs backwards thinking and lack of b***s to stand up to certain people

 

[dmrodgers]

I hope I'm way off the mark with this but the longer this seems to go on and on I'm getting more and more worried that this will not be a happy ending for the airport knowing how the anti airport brigade at Leeds City Council works. I understand from previous comments on here that the airport will appeal the outcome if it goes against them, however this will no doubt go backwards and forwards for another 12 months plus with each side stating there point of view. All this at a time when two another Labour councils are pumping millions into supporting their airports.

 

[Snackbar]

I hope I'm way off the mark with this but the longer this seems to go on and on I'm getting more and more worried that this will not be a happy ending for the airport knowing how the anti airport brigade at Leeds City Council works. I understand from previous comments on here that the airport will appeal the outcome if it goes against them, however this will no doubt go backwards and forwards for another 12 months plus with each side stating there point of view. All this at a time when two another Labour councils are pumping millions into supporting their airports.

The public enquiry is slated for 11 March 2025 so not so long to wait. Of course this could then to a judicial review!
At the end of the day by forcing a public enquiry it’s now been taken out of the Clowncials hands….