Future Infrastructure Developments

[lbaspotter]

You don't close an airport at all if you can avoid it.

Well its exactly what East Midlands did throughout November and early December 2016. The airport's runway was closed for 48 hours every Saturday night at 20:00hrs and didn't reopen until 20:00hrs on the Monday. All the airlines rescheduled there flights to operate around it which included the likes of Ryanair, Jet2, Thomson & Thomas Cook... Even the Cargo airlines (eg DHL) operated around the restrictions diverting some into Doncaster-Sheffield or just flying straight past without stopping off.

 

[White Heather]

Well its exactly what East Midlands did throughout November and early December 2016. The airport's runway was closed for 48 hours every Saturday night at 20:00hrs and didn't reopen until 20:00hrs on the Monday. All the airlines rescheduled there flights to operate around it which included the likes of Ryanair, Jet2, Thomson & Thomas Cook... Even the Cargo airlines (eg DHL) operated around the restrictions diverting some into Doncaster-Sheffield or just flying straight past without stopping off.

So perhaps at EMA it was unavoidable! At LBA the runway construction means it isn't necessary to resurface the entire runway - just individual concrete blocks that go to make up the surface.

 

[rmac]

Whilst passing LBA to-day I took advantage of the 1hour Free Parking with the 3-4 minute walk to the Terminal. This was excellent and a chance to see the ongoing improvements. My only comment - whilst walking TO the terminal is easy and marked, coming BACK is not so easy and didn't appear to be sign posted. I missed the proper route but easily found my way again but I could imagine coming back at night, maybe raining, you could get lost. A couple of signs would not go amiss!

 

[White Heather]

Whilst passing LBA to-day I took advantage of the 1hour Free Parking with the 3-4 minute walk to the Terminal. This was excellent and a chance to see the ongoing improvements. My only comment - whilst walking TO the terminal is easy and marked, coming BACK is not so easy and didn't appear to be sign posted. I missed the proper route but easily found my way again but I could imagine coming back at night, maybe raining, you could get lost. A couple of signs would not go amiss!

Rmac, as per my report from last Friday's consultative meeting, LBA are replacing/upgrading all signage this year so hopefully this will be taken care of as part of that. It might be worthwhile dropping the airport an email though to advise them of the problem so if they hadn't noticed, they can ensure it is included.

 

[White Heather]

Whilst passing LBA to-day I took advantage of the 1hour Free Parking with the 3-4 minute walk to the Terminal. This was excellent and a chance to see the ongoing improvements. My only comment - whilst walking TO the terminal is easy and marked, coming BACK is not so easy and didn't appear to be sign posted. I missed the proper route but easily found my way again but I could imagine coming back at night, maybe raining, you could get lost. A couple of signs would not go amiss!

Rmac, as per my report from last Friday's consultative meeting, LBA are replacing/upgrading all signage this year so hopefully this will be taken care of as part of that. It might be worthwhile dropping the airport an email though to advise them of the problem so if they hadn't noticed, they can ensure it is included.

 

[cmj]

How long did the walk take (roughly)?

 

[Aviador]

From the terminal to the free pick up and drop off it shouldn't take more than 5 minutes. Used to to the walk regularly.

 

[Tarn Spotter]

I think it depends on your age and fitness. When the 1hr car park opened we used to try and save the £3 fee on the short term.
It was a windy day and my OH's inhaler ran out of juice and it was a very unpleasant and least 10 minute walk, never to be repeated. Your even more exposed then the walk from the short stay car park. In addition the first door of the terminal were closed which extended our outside exposure. We could not locate a wheel chair or assistance point in this car park.
The short stay without any cover is a hardship for those of us who are no longer nimble on our pins and cant speed up our walking pace even if the heavens are open and raining hard and its even worse for my OH in a wheel chair.

 

[lbaspotter]

This is not having a pop at anyone but I really can't understand why some people whom don't find walking the distance (between Car Park and Terminal) easy enough unless due to either health, fitness issues or bad weather related, why not use the Car Park shuttle bus service which is provided by the airport for free of charge.
Instead all we see or read on here is yet more complaints....

Now I know the signage is another problem, Which if the airport owners are told about maybe able to do something about it, Like White Heather said before new signage is been put up around the airport..

 

[Tarn Spotter]

I thinbk you would understand if you had mobility issues.
Requesting the car park shuttle bus is not an option for many disabled. Last time we pressed the assistance button (4am) told would be 30 minutes before a vehicle arrived and it would not have wheel chair access.
The last bus we tried to get on the wheel chair area full of childrens buggies/luggage etc, the driver refused to let us on, why should we put ourselves in a position of having to stand around, when not certain to get on the bus.
Monarch recently took us up in the lift to gate 5 and then advised could not take us through gates 6/7 due to security matters to stand 12. They had requested we arrived 3 hours before so they could ensure no issues.
Its not funny when staff advising were delaying boarding in full view of other passengers and cant we manage the stairs.
We started using LBA around 1955 with a wheel chair, but it has only since the problems at Glasgow we have had issues getting close to the terminal.
At least you did not suggest using Arrow taxis to get near the terminal as one airport employee suggested.

 

[cmj]

Thanks. Unless the weather crap I may give that a go. Probably walk more across Schipol during the connections.

 

[Aviador]

Just to reiterate what Tarn Spotter said, the walk isn't suitable for people with reduced mobility although alternative arrangements might be possible by contacting the airport beforehand.

The airport website does not say bus transfer to the terminal is possible from the 1 hour free zone.

 

[White Heather]

The car park shuttle bus doesn't run through the 1 hour drop off car park. Last week I raised exactly the issue Tarn Spotter mentions - that disabled passengers and those who have difficulty walking find that walk, which is slightly uphill, very difficult, especially if they have luggage too, but they can't get on the bus. I asked the airport to consider re-routing the bus so it does pick up in, or just outside the drop off car park, or that a lower drop off rate is available for those who cannot make the walk due to disability etc. The airport were 'non committal'. My view is that if disabled passengers are not offered a no cost option that they can reasonbly use, the same as everyone else, then they are not being treated equally.

 

[Aviador]

It used to be possible for disabled airport users to park in the long stay car park, catch a bus to the terminal and get an hours free parking. It wasn't openly advertised because it was possible for anyone to do this.

 

[whoshotjimmi]

The car park shuttle bus doesn't run through the 1 hour drop off car park. Last week I raised exactly the issue Tarn Spotter mentions - that disabled passengers and those who have difficulty walking find that walk, which is slightly uphill, very difficult, especially if they have luggage too, but they can't get on the bus. I asked the airport to consider re-routing the bus so it does pick up in, or just outside the drop off car park, or that a lower drop off rate is available for those who cannot make the walk due to disability etc. The airport were 'non committal'. My view is that if disabled passengers are not offered a no cost option that they can reasonbly use, the same as everyone else, then they are not being treated equally.

In this situation, White Heather, the airport would be liable to the Equality Act 2010 and would be covered specifically by the section on access to goods, services and facilities which states, among other things:

"Service providers have to make reasonable adjustments for disabled people in the way they deliver their services. This is so that a disabled person is not put at a substantial disadvantage compared to non-disabled people in accessing the services."

However, the act does NOT set out guidelines for what this means so there is a significant grey area. I would have thought that, as the airport does already provide parking right outside the terminal entrance, they are already covered, despite the fact that this is a paid facility and the one hour drop off is free. It could be argued that the free option is more difficult for disabled people to use but as there is nothing stopping disabled persons using the car park at the terminal entrance per se, access is not necessarily being hindered.

Should it be found to be discriminatory, I would have thought that, based on the low usage of the one hour free car park and cost of implementing bus service to it, the airport would do just as well closing the free parking area altogether, though it may be a bit of a PR issue. In this case, any indirect discrimination would be eradicated. In any case, based on the act as it stands and the provisions LBA already has, I do not believe they would be in violation. I have attached a summary of the act below.

http://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN01749/SN01749.pdf

 

[Aviador]

Didn't the opening of the free zone become a condition of the airports planning application to extend the terminal?

In this situation, White Heather, the airport would be liable to the Equality Act 2010

I'm not disputing that but as I said in my previous post, I'm sure the airport provides free 1 hour parking in the long stay where there is ample disabled spaces. The provision of this would probably constitute a reasonable adjustment.

 

[whoshotjimmi]

Didn't the opening of the free zone become a condition of the airports planning application to extend the terminal?



I'm not disputing that but as I said in my previous post, I'm sure the airport provides free 1 hour parking in the long stay where there is ample disabled spaces. The provision of this would probably constitute a reasonable adjustment.

You're probably very right. My point is that, because car parking is available, with step free access, the airport more than likely isn't in violation of the act anyway when it comes to that matter and should be dealt with as a customer service complaint rather than an equality one. Indeed, they are more likely to be in violation of it if they provide a bus service that then is not fully accessible and Tarn Spotter's above post is a perfect example of the sort of actions that would lead one to being in violation of the Equality Act.

I would hope that he spent the time pointing this out to the various stakeholders as companies are very sensitive to possibility of monetary fines and damage to reputation and will usually take steps to compensate and improve standards. Though fines are usually low (£1-£3k), they are unlimited and are set by the court judgement, along with notice served to change practices. You may remember the case of Ross v Ryanair (http://www.stammeringlaw.org.uk/cases/ross.htm) which was very damaging to both Ryanair and Stansted Airport. For Tarn Spotter to be forced to walk down stairs as a wheelchair user is tantamount to the same thing, as is being refused entry to a bus because luggage is in the wheelchair area.

Having said all of this and despite the issues faced by Tarn Spotter, the free car park is overblown to some extent by users of LBA in the same way as the parking charge, the terminal building and the airside walkway. In most cases, that facility at least at LBA is equal to, if not better than, most other airports in the UK, if not Europe. There are definitely things the airport can do far better including vastly improving customer service inside the terminal building which, on my last few visits, has been terrible but the overriding problem is that of poor PR which has been a significant weakness of the incumbent management team throughout their reign.

 

[Tarn Spotter]

I would be just happy for parking near the terminal with undercover facilities to the terminal. The disabled parking area in the short term car park is too far from the terminal.
I can cope and walk 20 metres before by stats go in to the red and balance issues make walking down stairs in natural light virtually impossible.
At European airports Malaga, Krakow, Budapest etc you can park by the door, whilst terrorist threat is real, surely blue badge holders can be catered for. At the moment you have to give LBA 48 hours notice for special assistance, surely your car reg., blue badge details and the car to only contain the driver + carer, should enable you to park by the terminal.
I would like to see us blue badge holders having to show, to use the designated disabled seating in the terminal and be able to use fast Track even if not in a wheel chair.
I dont want to sue anyone, I just want people to appreciate our needs and find some sensible answers.

 

[Tarn Spotter]

I should have offered thanks to White Heather in the above thead for the sterling work she does on everyone's behalf.
I keep asking others to raise concerns etc with the airport/airlines as I feel nowdays letters from me get binned. I was told by the BBC last year that my views no longer required as they wished others to have a say, fine, but I dont hear any others making the case

 

[White Heather]

Thanks Tarn Spotter.