Leeds Bradford Airport Parking

[White Heather]

Aviador, surely all those suggestions you put forward (which are quite valid) require those particular businesses to invest in the airport, and firstly, the may not wish to, and secondly, the profit from them will be theirs, not the airports. The only money the airport would make would be the ground rent. I am sure that the airport would love to get people to build such things, but there is the problem - doing so requires planning consent (again). That can take ages and as usual all the tree huggers will be complaining then about more building going on. Frankly, the airport cannot win on this one. We shouldn't be making out that LBA are the only ones doing this though - it was confirmed at the last JCC meeting that the majority of airports are charging in this way now, and those that are not, will be soon. Some airports also charge every passenger a £10 fee just for using the airport! As for car drivers paying the fee - well if they are unable to do so, they should get their £2 back from the passengers, who in my view (still!) are getting a bargain at £2 for up to 4 passengers. I keep on saying it, but there are alternatives - nobody is forcing them to use a car. This is clearly a very emotive issue and one that we are all going to have to agree to disagree on, but as an airport supporter and as a car driver, I have no problem with paying £2 for the departure and arrival, and if drivers had not clogged up the local roads trying to avoid paying under the old system, this one would not have been introduced. Drivers have, to a certain extent, reaped what they sowed.

 

[Aviador]

The revenue ideas were just off the top of my head. Clearly those ideas would also come with problems as you say, but there must be alternatives the airport can consider before charging people who don't necessarily wish to park.

I appreciate all the arguments 'in favour' of the new charge but as one member of the forum has put it, it's "Yorkshire's first stretch of TOLL road." and one expensive one at that for the two minute 300m journey.

Leaving the new charges aside.

The drop-off and pick-up zone was the first development carried out by Bridgepoint since arriving at Leeds Bradford airport. The new pick-up and drop-off facility is a significant improvement on what the airport had before.

So it seems silly to discourage people from using it.

Anyway, like you say, parking issues have been thrashed out at the Consultative Committee meetings more than enough and probably more times than you care to remember.

For the sake of Leeds Bradford airport, I just hope people don't vote with their feet and use alternative airports.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Drop-off parking charges are the latest ancillary revenue streams for regional airports that see their primary sources of income beaten down and down by airlines.

Whenever and wherever it happens the local press pretend to be up in arms and letters appear from angry punters saying they will never use the airport again............but they always do - of course.

In LBA's case the local journalist has decided to go completely over the top and even those vehemently opposed to the charges and even to the presence of the airport itself will see the man has made a complete fool of himself. Of course, the ultimate responsibility lies with the editor.

Drop-off charges, fast-track security charges, baggage trolley charges, plastic bag charges are all attempts by airports to increase revenue but, as with many additional low-cost airline charges, most can be avoided with a bit of pre-planning.

That's why I fear that it won't be long before airports who don't levy a departure charge on each passenger will be in a small minority because the only way to avoid this charge is not to travel at all.

Just think what a modest £5 per person departure charge would raise for LBA's owners - around £7.5 million per year (based on approximately 1.5 million passengers flying out every twelve months).

The likes of Ryanair would kick up a tremendous fuss and make dire threats but if all regional airports were doing it ....................................

 

[Aviador]

Thanks TheLocalYokel. For sure once these kind of charges are implemented at all airports there will be nothing people can moan about. Clearly, it's airlines such as Ryanair that have ultimately caused this situation whereby airports are required to look for alternative forms of income. I do wonder how full service airlines perceive these kind of airport charges, even to the point of wondering if they will be put off operating new flights because of them.

 

[rmac]

Here in Edinburgh we have been through all this about drop off charges, articles in the paper, protests, moans etc etc but now it is all forgotten about and everyone just gets on with the new arrangement. It all seems to be working okay and of course there is an area away from the terminal where you can be dropped off at no cost and taken in by bus in only a few moments. Nevertheless I thought the YEP article was very disloyal to Yorkshire and I hope the editor will be more supportive of the local airport in the future and not allow such damaging comments to be published. The airport, like all airports needs the money and hopefully the end result will be better facilities for all concerned and especially foreigners arriving, maybe for the first time, will be given a good first impression of Yorkshire. In time the disquiet about the fee will be forgotten and hopefully the badly needed terminal improvements will be underway.

 

[White Heather]

Ulitmately, some airports will go to the wall and be lost forever. There are already rumours about MAN airport group considering the future of Bournemouth and Humberside, and I am sure that other small airports such as Durham Tees Valley will also come under the microscope, because for them, its a vicious circle. Their income from landing fees is minimal. If they try to charge a terminal 'tax', both passengers and airlines desert them (as happened at Norwich). If they try to make money through parking charges, there is an almighty backlash and again, the risk that passengers will vote with their feet (or rather their steering wheels) and head off to another airport where they don't yet charge, or perhaps charge less. It amazed me when I was told it costs £29m per year to operate LBA, so the airport company have to make a lot more than that to be in profit and have the capital to invest in the infrastructure. With low cost airlines paying next to nothing to use the airport, planners getting all uppity every time someone wants to construct a new business on airport land, passengers and airlines all demanding better facilities, running an airport these days must be a difficult task, certainly not helped by ludicrous articles such as this one. It is to be hoped that some of the thousands of staff who work at LBA and whose livelihoods depend on it, will make the YEP absolutely sure what they think of this garbage, since he is effectively trying to put them all out of a job!

If I was the editor at the YEP, he would be the first to lose his!

 

[stewief1]

Interesting sight tonight as i left the front of the terminal following my flight from AMS - the 'kiss &fly tax' rip-off zone was empty. Clearly, ppl are voting with their feet and plainly not using it, which i personally, am well happy to see. Granted, it was 21.00 hrs, so not peak time, but even so...! What was also interesting was the amount of ppl walking off the main airport grounds down to White House Lane, and being picked up at Travel Lodge/on-street. The police were keen at moving ppl on if they pulled over for just a second. Also, a 'Civil Enforcement Office' also made an appearance - presumably the £2 drop-off fee will be paying his wages. I hope the users of the airport know they are being ripped off by this scam - lowering it to £1 (in line with other airports) might be a comprimise. Incidentally, the 'free-ride' bus to the long stay car-park was sat redundant, engine off, minus a driver. they might be offering a free service, but from what i saw, they weren't providing it. :nea:

 

[User0001]

According to the accounts for the airport which are available at companies house (for year ending March 2010), the airport would have made a loss of £17m were it not for the income it recieves from car parking and retail. The revenue it gets from airlines worked out at less than £3 per passenger (note - this was in the year before the Ryanair base opened !)

People might not like paying for trolleys, security fast lanes or car parking, but without it, there would be no viable airport business - at least in passenger number / flight frequency terms.

 

[Aviador]

White Heather

I hadn't come across this article before I posted about the potential for retail units outside the airport at Leeds Bradford, but this is apparently what is already being done at Stansted airport. So perhaps the idea isn't as far fetched after all.

New Starbucks drive-thru for Stansted Airport

Work has begun on a new drive-through Starbucks cafe at Stansted Airport. The American coffee house is the latest big name to set up at the Southgate site, south of the A120 at Takeley, which is already home to McDonald’s, Holiday Inn Express and a BP petrol filling station.

The single-storey cafe will have seating for 85 customers, provide take-away snacks and beverages and have a drive-through lane similar to neighbour McDonald’s – the two outlets will share the same bell-mouth access.

Source

 

[Hope]

Just returned from dropping off relatives at LBA and I am so annoyed I had to join this Forum and share things! It's not only the £2 parking charge that I dislike - it's the lack of choice introduced by very poor signage and a road layout which sends you on a one way route into the restricted/parking areas. There used to be a mini roundabout on the highway section in front of the short stays which gave you an option to turn and leave, but now the highwlay goes straight into the one way system and the inevitable charge or a fine. How on earth did the Highway Authority think this layout is appropriate? Perhaps LBA should have spent a little less money fighting the recent public inquiry on that well-know nearby carpark and a little more money on sensible signage and information.

LBA say their customers support the charge. Don't talk rubbish. This customer is getting fed up with the poor facilities and the attitude of those who run LBA and advise on their parking startegy. I live close enough to other airports to switch. Yes, other airports have similar parking issues but the facilities inside are so much better.

If you have to charge drop-off parking to make an overall profit there is something very wrong with the whole financial model.

 

[User0001]

I was in Yeadon yesterday so made a detour to the airport to see what all the fuss (if indeed there is any) is all about. Turning onto Whitehouse Lane from the A658, there are two green signs on the left, advising that the minimum charge for terminal front / short stay is £2. There were then two red signs on the right hand side, just before the turn-off into the airport complex giving further warnings. I went in and counted 25 other cars in the terminal front car park, had a stroll around, bought a paper, and counted another 10 entering the car park during my walk. There was one guy being picked up by the mini- roundabout on the exit from the complex, but otherwise the comings and goings seemed no different to usual.

There is nothing wrong with the financial model per se, it has just changed. It used to be the case that airports were making significantly more per passenger than the airlines who were actually flying the people. Even small regional ones were profitable and generated positive cash. LBA was making a few million back in the early 90s and had half the passengers it does today. Ryanair / Jet2 / Easyjet etc have changed the dynamic completely and now airports have to accept airlines will either pay them next to nothing or they will take their business to an airport who will. In this regard, LBA is not just competing with the other airports on its doorstep, but most of the airports across Europe. Ryanair can take their 2 aircraft out of Leeds and put them in an ex-military airfield in Eastern Europe and everyone knows that is exactly what they will do if the deal is right.

At the end of the day, the general public are as complicit in all of this as anyone. When people had a choice, they deserted legacy carriers like bmi and BA for short-haul flights - who were paying airports a decent amount per passenger - and switched to airlines like Ryanair and Easyjet, who don't pay airports much. If people had chosen to pay more for the air ticket, there would still be free refreshments on board, free luggage and you wouldn't be paying to drop people off at the airport.

I'm not convinced the public at large will be particularly bothered to be honest. The airport could probably have done a better job at explaining why revenue from car parking and shopping is the difference between there being an airport offering over 3m seats a year and a glorified flying club with a few KLM and bmi flights.

I'm sure they will see how it goes this summer and if the airlines start to tell them it is impacting bookings, they will no doubt review it and find another way to get the money. The only thing that is certain, is that they will get the money one way or another.

 

[White Heather]

Excellent post LS16 - completely agree with you.

Hope - sorry but I am a customer of LBA, and I do not mind paying the £2 and personally cannot see what all the fuss is about, especially as other airports are now starting to charge in a similar way. For many the journey to and from those other airports will cost far more than £2, if only for the fuel. And yes, the facilities are poor at LBA but we all know that is about to change. What is so difficult to understand about the business model? The airport has to make a profit and Bridgepoint have shareholders. If they are to invest in the airport facilities, they have to make a profit to finance such investment and for the reasons given by LS16 above, airports do not generally make profit now from low cost airlines, which are the predominant carriers at LBA. They therefore rely on profit from parking and retail.

Aviador, your suggestion about retail outlets was not at all far fetched and hopefully it will happen. The point I was trying to make is that to open such outlets, planning approval has to be obtained and we all know how fussy the council are about buildings in the vicinity of LBA. It will be simpler if the facilities are built on LBA owned land that is already earmarked for development, but clearly that is in short supply near the terminal, and any profit arising from the outlet will mainly be for the operator. LBA will pick up the rent. Being honest, the amount of space available around the terminal would not be sufficient to make money on a scale that would make a great deal of difference to Bridgepoint. Stansted is a completely different animal - much bigger, many more passengers (so more attractive to franchises and therefore attracting higher rents), and lots more places to build them too.

 

[lbaspotter]

Here we go again. The rip-off Black and white, Leeds taxi firms are charging an extra £4 per return trip and are now going to start a petition "lobbying “greedy” airport bosses to scrap new drop-off charges"

And who are the first to report it. Good old Yorkshire Evening Post yet again...

Source: http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co....rd_airport_drop_off_charges_protest_1_3478404

Cabbies’ Leeds Bradford Airport drop off charges protest

By Sam Casey
Published on Wednesday 15 June 2011 08:00

TAXI drivers are lobbying “greedy” airport bosses to scrap new drop-off charges.

As reported in the Yorkshire Evening Post, anyone wanting to drop off or collect passengers outside the terminal building at Leeds Bradford Airport now has to pay £2, no matter how brief their stop.

The move has attracted widespread criticism from the public. Coun Andrew Carter, leader of the Tory group on Leeds City Council, branded the charge a “rip-off”.

Now the Professional Drivers’ Branch of the GMB union has launched a petition demanding that the charges are dropped.

Yorkshire branch secretary Javaid Akhtar, also a Leeds councillor and taxi driver, said: “The sad thing is that the airport management have become so greedy.

“It’s about time the people of this city and region stood up and said something.”

Under the new system, cars’ number plates are recorded by cameras as they enter the short-stay car park outside the terminal.

The driver’s fee, which rises to £5 after half an hour, is calculated when they leave and can be paid in cash or by card.

Security staff are posted at the exit barriers to ensure fees are paid.

Naeem Azam, Yorkshire branch president for the GMB’s Professional Drivers’ Branch, said cabbies had no choice but to add the cost of the new charge to fares. It’s an extra £4 for a two-way trip,” he said.

The airport has introduced a free drop-off facility in the long-stay car parks half-a-mile from the terminal. A shuttle bus runs on a continuous loop to ferry passengers to the terminal and back.

Private hire drivers can pay an annual £25 subscription to use the short-stay car park for up to 15 minutes.

But Mr Akhtar said: “We want the airport to stop penalising people. They are giving the airport business and yet, ultimately, they are being pushed elsewhere.”

The petitions will be placed in taxi offices and cabs for passengers to sign.

The airport did not wish to comment

 

[tleeds]

At-least this article is not pointing the finger, as much as the other-one a few weeks ago was.

I still think that a large majority of passengers and The General Public don't understand what many users on here have thoroughly explained – That the airport is more dependent on passengers to provide finance as the airlines have become a lot more ruthless.
If the Yorkshire Evening Post had explained that, then I think a lot more people would be more understanding - That the airport require more revenue from passengers, to carry-out vital re-furb's that they ultimately want!

 

[White Heather]

Perhaps LBA management should respond with something soon confirming the reason for the charges and that the money is to be re-invested in the terminal. At least this article did mention the free parking, although it is not half a mile away, and it also mentioned the £25 per year fee that taxis can opt to pay, which gives them 15 minutes per visit at no cost. And, how can they charge £4 extra for a 'two way trip' when they only go into the airport drop off area once and pay £2 for the privilege. They are doubling the charge to their customer, and if that is the case, they are actually worse than they allege the airport to be. At least the airport will be investing the profit into the airport facilities and hopefully giving us more routes, airlines etc. I can't see the taxi companies investing the extra money they appear intent on making!

 

[Bhowani]

Used the "new system" Sunday am. Like a lot folks, my clan leave their cars at Bhowani
Towers & I run them up to LBA. Lots of happy pax, no moans and 1 million times better than the M62 which was having severe problemas again this am (Monday).
And I get a spare car for the week!

 

[White Heather]

I think the whole thing is being blown out of proportion, especially by the Evening Post's reporter, who is at it yet again today. Now they are complaining that people who park on the double yellow lines are being moved on or given a ticket by the council. It is almost like they are encouraging people to break the law to avoid paying the £2 fee. As posted above, I really do think that the airport should do something to appease people by at least explaining the situation, the free options, and their plans for the terminal, otherwise this just isn't going away, and frankly, the whole thing is getting boring now. I wouldn't mind betting that 9 out of 10 folk would rather pay £2 to go into LBA than spend a lot more going over to MAN and back, and MAN are, or soon will be, charging themselves. Perhaps it will only be £1, but lets face it, they already have the infrastructure and considerably more passengers/income, so being frank, they need it a little less, particularly given that they have far more mainline airlines so attract far higher income from landing fees.

 

[News Guru]

[textarea]Leeds Bradford Airport signs blunder

Airport bosses broke planning rules when they installed road signs to publicise new controversial drop-off charges.

Management at Leeds Bradford International Airport failed to seek planning permission before erecting signs on White House Lane telling passengers about the £2 toll which has caused angry complaints.

The notices breach guidelines on style, content and letter size. They may also have been put up in the wrong places.

Airport officials declined to say why they failed to consult highways officials before putting up the signs. They have been ordered to replace them.

A council spokesman said: “The new signs on White House Lane alerting passengers to the new pick-up and drop-off arrangements at the airport do not meet national road sign guidelines.

“We have spoken with the airport and will ensure they resolve the matter as quickly as possible.”

A former airport employee, who did not want to be named, said: “They never applied for planning permission, they just banged them up.

“As soon as someone from the highways department came down, they told them they didn’t comply with the law.”

Otley & Yeadon councillor Colin Campbell added: “You can’t just go around putting signs up without planning permission if you feel like it. They should know that.”

The signs were put up last month when the £2 charge was introduced for any motorists wanting to drop off or pick up passengers outside the terminal building.

The fee, which increases to £5 after 30 minutes, replaced the free 10-minute drop-off period.

Members of airport staff have been trained by the council to act as traffic wardens to stop people using White House Lane, which is marked with double yellow lines, as an unofficial drop-off area.

Drivers can now use the long-stay car park – half a mile from the terminal building – for free for up to an hour.

Andrew Carter, leader of the Conservative group on Leeds City Council, branded the charge a “rip-off”.

Taxi drivers have launched a petition calling for it to be scrapped.

Frequent flyer Prof Paul Kind, of York University, is among the passengers annoyed at the new charges. He said the shoddy road signs were a “victory for incompetence.”

“It indicates to me that this whole thing has been half-cocked, badly planned and badly executed,” he added.

Source[/textarea]

 

[stewief1]

The above post makes me very happy. Glad the local MP's are getting onboard with this disgrace! I did make a comment about the signage in a previous post - some how had a gut feeling it wasn't legal. Hard to defend this blatant disregard disregard and ignorance.

 

[User0001]

Doesn't bother me in the slightest, but I guess everyone has their own point of view. Then again, I have the airport accounts for the last 3 years, so know how much they are losing per passenger without the car parking and retail income.