Qatar Airways

[TheLocalYokel]

I note an ongoing discussion in the Dried Plum where some posters are suggesting a narrow-bodied aircraft initially, leading to a larger aircraft as the route matures.

I can see some advantages in that: presumably lower operating costs and (probably) higher load factors. Against that is less cargo space, but will CWL be able to set up a thriving cargo operation by the time the route begins next year? If not, and I would have thought that it's unlikely in the timescale available, then the cargo question would not be of such critical importance early on in the route's life.

Ideally, a wide-bodied aircraft would operate from the beginning (and it still might) but a smaller aircraft might mean a higher frequency and reduce the pressure to fill the aircraft from the outset, or as near full as the airline would consider satisfactory.

As some have already made the point elsewhere, the important thing is to have the route and if the airport is given more time to build it into a thriving wide-bodied operation it might not be such a bad thing. Of course, it may be that from its sums Qatar is confident that a wide-bodied aircraft is the right equipment from the word go.

Availability of aircraft type might also be a factor but I'm not up to date with the current Qatar fleet situation.

 

[Jerry]

Availability of aircraft type might also be a factor but I'm not up to date with the current Qatar fleet situation.

From what i've read Qatar seem to be slowly receiving A350 900s though airbus are behind but i think they expect another 11 during this year. I'm not sure about the narrow bodies but i read that A321neoLR aircraft weren't due to 2019. The 737 MAX that the one poster mentioned isn't due to go into the Qatar fleet it's for other projects.
Many people do say it's good to have the service and to start narrow and build up but the problem I see with that will be the perception of having a narrow body service instead of a wide body service. Many people would see that as negative and continue to use LHR. That's why i really hope it'll be wide bodied because that is what people will expect. Hopefully the newly arrived A350's will upgrade the 787 services on LHR or BHX or EDI or MAN freeing up a 787 for CWL.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Many people do say it's good to have the service and to start narrow and build up but the problem I see with that will be the perception of having a narrow body service instead of a wide body service. Many people would see that as negative and continue to use LHR. That's why i really hope it'll be wide bodied because that is what people will expect. Hopefully the newly arrived A350's will upgrade the 787 services on LHR or BHX or EDI or MAN freeing up a 787 for CWL.

I believe that the Qatar 787-8s have a seating capacity of just above 250. Even a 70% load factor is still a lot of seats to fill on a daily basis and I suspect that the majority of passengers will come from those who have an origin or destination in South Wales.

They are more likely to use a local service as it's in their back garden and much easier to access than LHR, or even BHX. Some might eschew it if it was a narrow-body but wouldn't many still regard it as better than going to London?

Getting a significant proportion of travellers from further afield might be more problematical, whatever the aircraft type, given the range of alternatives (both in airlines and frequency) at Heathrow which is where most West Country (a key target area for CWL's service) travellers automatically look for their long-haul scheduled travel.

Another thing is that both Emirates and Etihad offer complimentary chauffeured cars for their first-class and business travellers (a good business class take-up will be of great importance to the route), so a premium traveller living in the West Country wouldn't necessarily regard the shorter journey to CWL as an advantage if they were getting a 'free' ride to LHR with EK or EY both of which have greater frequency from there.

These are some of the reasons why I think that a smaller aircraft might be a better bet to begin with but I accept that I might be misjudging the market.

 

[Jerry]

These are some of the reasons why I think that a smaller aircraft might be a better bet to begin with but I accept that I might be misjudging the market.

It think the problem for CWL with starting with a narrow body would be the perception and I believe many would see it as negative. The airport still has a negative image in many people's eyes in South Wales and always lives in other airports shadow's.
Most of the passengers will come from the South Wales area but there will be top up from not just the West Country but abroad from the likes of China, Australia and SE Asia.
My personal opinion is that if Qatar didn't think they could fill up 787 then they wouldn't be doing the service. If they planned a narrow body only service then why not just go to BRS?

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I don't think that they went to CWL because they could not operate a wide-body at BRS. The 787-8 could reach Doha easily - after all the TOM 787-8s have been flying to Cancun (9 hours-plus) with full passenger loads and I am told that the headwinds when flying west on the route have been very strong in the past two weeks.

The lack of cargo at BRS might have played a part in choosing CWL, together with what appears to be a good relationship with the Welsh Government in terms of potential trade links, something that the local authorities in the BRS area could not hope to emulate at their lower level in the governmental chain.

I would have had the same views about beginning cautiously with perhaps smaller equipment had Qatar opted for BRS. I'm very happy to be proved wrong when the CWL route begins.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

https://www.ianallantravel.com/blog/qatar-airways-is-better-connected-with-national-express/

Seems a surprising move in respect of South Wales and South West England cities and towns. With the new CWL service starting next year why do they include South Wales and the South West in their new partnership with National Express to channel passengers onto their LHR services?

 

[Jerry]

Could be just a national contract and National Express have just included South Wales and the South West. Monarch have been advertising on First buses nationwide including Scotland and they don't fly from there anymore. Plus the CWL service doesn't start for at least a year so they will be wanting to attract pax to their LHR service. Also any pax who use Qatar's LHR flights from S.Wales and possibly the S.West may then shift over to the CWL service if they are already Qatar customers.

 

[Jerry]

Potential bad news for the new service. Saudi Arabia, UAE, Bahrain and Egypt in the process of ending diplomatic ties and enforcing travel bans with Qatar over allegations of funding terrorism and involvement with Iran. Which the Qatari government denies. This means Qatar Airways would lose a lot of connections like DXB and AUH and overflight rights.
Hopefully this diplomatic spat will be sorted out soon otherwise it'll have a major impact on Qatar Airways and it's new service to Cardiff.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Qatar received a lot of adverse publicity in recent years regarding the working conditions of those constructing the football grounds for the World Cup Finals there in 2022. It was said that there were over 1,000 deaths amongst workers who were paid low wages and virtually kept prisoner because they were not allowed to leave the country without an exit visa.

That criticism seems to have abated in recent times, or at least the reporting of it has. I don't know if or how Qatar reacted to deal with the situation, or perhaps the news media simply became bored with it and that's why it's not so much in evidence these days.

No doubt the current political impasse will be resolved eventually. They usually are.

 

[Jerry]

Hopefully the situation will be resolved especially the connections to DXB be restored as many of the passengers may potentially connect onwards to Dubai and Abu Dhabi.

 

[thunderchild]

One thing is for certain Qatar won't be able to claim the usual "lack of aircraft" for not starting the route if this turns out to be a long-term scenario. Qatar flies flys to the UAE approx 30 times and with all the suspended flights to Saudi Arabia, Egypt etc they are going to have plenty of slack in their fleet. I wonder what the chances of BHX getting it's 8th weekly back if the situation becomes permanent?

 

[Jerry]

Qatar Airways and Cardiff airport are meeting business leaders today to outline the benefits of the new route starting in 2018. Notable people speaking include Roger Lewis, Debra Barber and Spencer Birns from Cardiff Airport and Glenn Mintrim from Qatar Airways.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-40327242

 

[Jerry]

Another article about the Qatar Airways business briefing in Wales Online. Also sampled this extract.
'Mr Mintrim gave no date for when the new service from Cardiff would start, but Cardiff Airport chairman Roger Lewis indicated that it could be in place in about a year's time.

He also suggested that the schedule would be “very exciting” and that potential passengers would “not be disappointed” by the frequency.'
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.wa...s/middle-east-problems-wont-stop-13211865.amp

Considering Qatar's problems at the moment the new flights are a good opportunity for the Welsh food industry as Qatar did import most of it's food via Saudi Arabia.

 

[User001]

There is an article on ch-aviation which states new routes (like Cardiff) will be started sooner than planned using the surplus capacity that is now redundant as a result of the travel ban in the GCC.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Wasn't the original thought in a number of aviation web sites a spring (March) 2018 commencement? If it's a daily schedule (as the airport company chairman might be suggesting) it will be an impressive beginning to a new long-haul route, especially if the B787 is the aircraft used.

 

[superking]

With Qatar having x number of aircraft with nothing to do,it looks like ba have stepped in and taken them on lease to their fleet. This is to cover most of the routes when the ba staff walk out.

 

[Jerry]

The application with the CAA states 9 A320/A321 aircraft to be wet leased between 1st and 16th July and possibly 2 months after. It suits both sides.

 

[Jerry]

Found an article stating the importance to business of the Qatar route. Compares it to the effect that the DXB route has had on NCL.
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/busine...-airways-flights-cardiff-airport-13231267.amp

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Found an article stating the importance to business of the Qatar route. Compares it to the effect that the DXB route has had on NCL.
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/busine...-airways-flights-cardiff-airport-13231267.amp

This is a great opportunity for Welsh business and economy - especially in the populous south of the country. I'll say it again - Qatar Airways is a huge capture for CWL.

 

[Jerry]

Hopefully as well the Welsh food industry
might be able to benefit from Saudi Arabia closing the border and Qatar having to look for alternative suppliers. Though obviously until the service starts the cargo would have to go through Heathrow probably.