Future Infrastructure Developments

[TheLocalYokel]

Am I misreading your thread if I say that it seems since the recession of 2008, capital expenditure at Bristol has been low and possibly lower then LBA.
In May 2007 Bridgepoint committed to invest 70 million on a airport they thought would be doing 3m by the end of 2008 (act 2.9m) and a steady growth to 7 million in 2015.

Most of the works described in the below quote have been carried out since 2008.

In recent years such things as the Western Walkway, the Central Walkway that's nearing completion, three new aircraft stands, new business lounge, turning much of landside into airside, expanded security and immigration stations have swallowed up in excess of £30 million.

BRS was hamstrung for many years because of the inordinate length of time that its expansion plans (most still to be constructed) were contested by the well-organised and well-funded objectors' group, so during that period it could only carry out works not requiring formal planning consent such as the £7 million 400-metre long Western Walkway which was built as general permitted development but because of this was limited in the type of facilities it could provide.

Now that 'proper' planning consent has cleared all obstacles the airport can crack on with its major expansion, the first part of which is the Central Walkway that is due to be completed this summer. The next major tasks will be the first half of doubling the terminal size and building an onsite hotel both of which it is hoped will begin within two years. Preliminary planning work by contractors for the terminal extension has been going on for over a year. If all the expansion plans come to fruition it's estimated it will be in the region of another £150 million which will be about £250 million in total since the airport was privatised in the late 1990s (part privatised initially). See below link.

http://www.bristolairport.co.uk/about-u ... pment.aspx

BRS, like many airports, is behind its master plan of a decade ago in passenger number projections, being currently about two million per annum down on what was forecast at that time or, put another way, it's running at about 75% of its projected figure. CWL, for instance, is much worse and is over three million down on its projections made in the early 'noughties', currently running at just 25% of that projected figure. From what you say LBA is likely to be running at about 45% of the projected figure for it made in 2007.

LBA has a much bigger immediate catchment than BRS but the latter has no serious competition outside the London airports and BHX (not inconsiderable competitors to put it mildly) in the whole of southern Britain and handles a third more passengers than the combined totals of Cardiff, Exeter, Newquay, Bournemouth and Southampton airports. That said, half of BRS's passenger numbers originate or terminate in Greater Bristol.

Now if BRS had been sited somewhere else (say Filton that has all the things that BRS lacks, or did have when its runway was open) who knows how busy it would be now? The same applies to an LBA sited more favourably.

BRS's major concern is governmental interference especially APD being devolved to the Wales Government which would almost certainly reduce it to a nil rate so that its flagship and only airport worthy of the name at CWL could become a facility of which the country and the Wales Government could be proud. At least LBA is not likely to have that sort of possible future obstacle.

 

[User0001]

Thanks for that update TheLocalYokel.
Am I misreading your thread if I say that it seems since the recession of 2008, capital expenditure at Bristol has been low and possibly lower then LBA.
In May 2007 Bridgepoint committed to invest 70 million on a airport they thought would be doing 3m by the end of 2008 (act 2.9m) and a steady growth to 7 million in 2015.
The facts are that last year 2013, we got to 2009 passenger numbers (3.3m). We are 4/5 years behind on the passengers numbers needed to justify the capital expenditure
If passenger numbers had not fallen sharply in 2009, over half a million on projections, maybe Bridgepoint would have been more bullish, who knows.
It should also be remembered that this was the period when M O L of Ryanair was holding a pistol to airport operators heads, not a good climate when the airline about to move more passengers then the rest, is prepared to move his base at the drop of a hat. Investors need certainty, not worry about the future.

The important thing to remember is that Bristol airport is catering for, planning for and actually pre developing the airport to keep track with its underlying potenetial. Whereas LBIA is nowhere near keeping track of its underlying potential. Bristol airport is broadly around the 6 million mark double where LBIA is. When the councils sold the airport it was to allow the airport to be pulled back towards its underlying potential by a company that was able to do that exact job.

There is an underlying potential at LBIA that would easily see the passenger throughput match Bristol airport's but underlying potential of an airport will only ever be realised if the management strategy is correct and the funds are in place to make the airport infrastructure attractive to airlines in advance and you have the funds to entice the airlines to the airfield at the expense of competitor airports. Airlines are not remotely interested in an airports underlying potential - they will fly from where they are best rewarded and encouraged to operate from.

Basically the stalling passenger figures that you have mentioned Tarn Spotter are the result of past infrastructure inaction / infrastructure cancelation and not the cause of the infrastructure inaction / infrastructure cancelation. The job that was needed to be done 7 years ago has not been done and therefore we are at present exactly where we were under council ownership 8 years ago. Instead of adding little bits of terminal add on extending down the apron under the councils the new owners have given Yorkshire passengers a weather shelter extending down the apron.

Bristol airport's masterplan is actually being built. LBIA's masterplan is now 3 years late being published.

 

[White Heather]

LBIA's masterplan is now 3 years late being published.

LUFC Pete - that, is not true. There is no specific requirement to produce another Masterplan by any given date let alone 3 years ago. Yes there is a requirement to review the existing Masterplan (which covers the period 2005-2016) but there is no specific time deadline for completing it. First mention of this only occurred in 2011 (when you seem to think it should have been published!) and in August of that year all action on it was postponed due to the Public Enquiry granting permission for off site parking near the airport - instantly removing a fair chunk of LBA's expected income stream. At that time, they suspended action on the Masterplan to assess the impace of this decision coupled with the impact of the economic downturn. It is now underway again and to quote LBA in December - 'gathering pace'. The transport strategy forms part of this - and you are aware of the visit by the Transport Minister yesterday. Before the revised Masterplan can be finalised, it has to go through the required consultation process.

However - the Masterplan is not affecting LBA's development now. They can extend parking stands if they need to now and they can build the terminal extension now. Bridgepoint have, however, made it very clear, that they do not operate on a basis of throwing money at the airport in the hope of attracting business - which appears to be the way you want them to operate. That equates to Peter Ridsdale throwing money around at LUFC in the hope of winning the Champions League - and look what happened when they didn't! Bridgepoint's method is to secure the business and when they need to extend, they will do so, and quickly. Granted there is a 'chicken and egg' issue here, but both John Parkin and Tony Hallwood have managed airports for a fair while and I have no reason to think they don't know how to run one.

I am as frustrated as anyone else about the time it takes to move things along, but it is not dependent on this Masterplan - which you appear to have a fixation on!

 

[Tarn Spotter]

LufcPete: Your comment on Bristol 6m plus passengers and capital expenditure is self defeating as a reason to beat Bridgepoint over the head.
Since 2008 passenger numbers at Bristol have gone down by 1.7% taking the period up to end 2013. (6.29m 2008, 6.12m 2013)
Leeds numbers have gone up by 15.9% in the same period (2.86m 2008, 3.31m 2013). So Bristol has spent all this money and yet seen there passenger numbers go down. Therefore the investment has not realised any return.
By providing new terminals etc it has not got the airlines falling over themselves to use the airport, I am sure there is some local factors at play, but is a fact, capital expenditure does not guarantee results.
Source of information http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/80/airport_da ... p_2008.pdf

 

[User0001]

Not quite sure how I'm self defeating? Yes they dropped passengers as virtually all airports have done during these recent years of recession. That is because they are broadly in line with their underlying potential. LBIA is far behind its underlying potential. The job of the now owners of LBIA seven years ago was to close the gap and bring our airport closer to its underlying potential passenger figure. That job is still to be done.

 

[User0001]

Because Bristol airport invested in the airport during the slack recession years it is now perfectly placed to accelerate its passenger figures by being very attractive to airlines who are now growing again. The airport does more than just servicing the underlying potential and is proactive rather than reactive.
LBIA on the other hand is still nowhere near even catering for its underlying potential. The stands are full.

 

[Tarn Spotter]

LUFC PETE: I cant compare Bristols 30 million capital expenditure. I have tried to find from Bridgepoints financial figures Leeds spend
However, I have only found a note in the Chairmans 2013 report that in 2012 they spent 11 million at Leeds, in the last 7 years I have seen continuous expenditure in the 50/60 trips I have made from the airport in this time.
They only need to be spending around 3m in the other 6 years to match the Bristol figure, your comments infer that no expenditure has occurred.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

LufcPete: Your comment on Bristol 6m plus passengers and capital expenditure is self defeating as a reason to beat Bridgepoint over the head.
Since 2008 passenger numbers at Bristol have gone down by 1.7% taking the period up to end 2013. (6.29m 2008, 6.12m 2013)
Leeds numbers have gone up by 15.9% in the same period (2.86m 2008, 3.31m 2013). So Bristol has spent all this money and yet seen there passenger numbers go down. Therefore the investment has not realised any return.
By providing new terminals etc it has not got the airlines falling over themselves to use the airport, I am sure there is some local factors at play, but is a fact, capital expenditure does not guarantee results.

You are undoubtedly right in respect of not increasing passenger numbers although Bristol actually had one bad year - 2009 when because of the recession passenger numbers dropped from 6.229 mppa to 5.615 mppa. Since then they've regained most of that loss with modest gains totalling around 9 % in each of the following four years but that would almost certainly have occurred without any of the infrastructure improvements. The passenger experience would have been worse though.

I'm of the opinion that whatever work is done at BRS a significant number of people will still moan about the place as instanced in Skytrax currently and in the local press. I believe that LBA experiences similar comments.

£150 million going forward from here seems an awful lot of money to increase passenger numbers by fewer than four million to the BRS planning limit of 10 mppa.

If airlines put on services that people want at an airport at a reasonable price most who fly will use them. They might criticise the airport experience but will many be so put out that they won't come back?

 

[scousefowler]

I hardly think return on any investment in the infrastructure would be measured in the number of passengers per annum. That would be ludicrous.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

I hardly think return on any investment in the infrastructure would be measured in the number of passengers per annum. That would be ludicrous.

In isolation I'm sure you are right. Airport owners would hope that improved infrastructure would increase passenger numbers by being more attractive to airlines and that the resultant increased footfall would boost the take on such things as retail spend, car parking fees and airport charges.

They would also obviously hope that the infrastructure developments would add book value to their capital assets.

From personal experience (and it's always going to be subjective) vast amounts of spending at some airports might increase profitability and produce an ultra modern looking facility but parts of the passenger experience can be horrendous. I'm thinking of Dubai in this respect, an airport I've used a lot as a transit passenger in recent years.

 

[Aviador]

You are spot on. They're making a more organised queuing area for security so passengers aren't meandering through the check in hall all the way down to international arrivals. As for the winter work, unless things have since changed they're building a mezzanine level in front of gate 5 where the old cafe was and filling in the void next to gate 7 top of the airside escalators. That's old hat so this plan could have changed since I was told but it makes more sense money wise than altering stairwells.

 

[airforced]

I hope Aviador that they are reorganising the check in area at the same time as it is a bit of a joke at the moment when you have a Monarch and a Thomson flight checking in at the same time. Can you add anything on that please?

 

[Aviador]

I don't see how that can be improved without building an entirely new check in hall and we know Bridgepoint aren't in the mood for spending money without an instant return on their investment.

 

[airforced]

No harm in doing a bit of wishful thinking though is there?

 

[Aviador]

Too true and sadly we're all going to have to keep dreaming. When JP took the reins he said "this airport will never have seen so much money", these words have smacked him in the face. For me at least, I find it difficult to have any enthusiasm for the place anymore. LBA mist the boat with 24 hour flying. It was given a lifeline when Jet2 came along. A chat with PM and he said "we just need the airport to get building, whatever space we get, we'll fill" and now the airport is in a period of self induced stagnation as on looking airports press ahead with developments and expansion.

That's my opinion anyway but I respect differing opinions.

 

[bobleeds]

I’m just daydreaming here, and not for one moment do I ever expect this to happen, but it struck me that with considerable vision and plenty of money, the former AVRO Building (now LBA Industrial Estate I think) could be made into the most amazing terminal.

The "valley" between the AVRO and the present terminal would need lots of backfilling, but this could be minimised by accommodating an underground station for the rail link, which could then be filled over, cut and cover style to create a huge apron. Aircraft gates could stretch along both the south and east sides of the AVRO, leaving the current terminal free to be demolished and concreted over.

I believe the huge AVRO building includes 1 or possibly 2 basement levels so lots of room for baggage, and other operations areas operations, possibly even drop off/pick up and car parking.

Ah well, dream over - back to reality I suppose!

 

[Bigman]

And how about over the road at Coney Park. Knock the new offices down and build a taxiway over Warren House Road to join with the runway.

 

[Allaboutthebirds]

There appears to be some form works starting on the terminal forecourt. I saw a digger and a mini dumper truck being unloaded this morning and some wire fencing going up. Is that to do with the work for increasing the security area or are they reconfiguring the forecourt for the new longer car park shuttle bus drop off/pick up area? Can Aviador or anyone else confirm what works they are doing?

The latter.

 

[rmac]

Yesterday I was at Aberdeen airport which is similar in size to LBA and noticed their multi storey car park which was not there when last I visited several years ago but I recall the idea of multi storey car park being suggested for LBA. Now that the management seem to keep on adding to the existing car parks so has the idea of a multi storey car park been abandoned? To me there are some good advantages - more spaces nearer the terminal, less walking etc, undercover for part of the way depending on where sited. In Edinburgh the Drop Off area is in the ground floor section (£1) and it is a very easy mostly covered walk to the terminal building. The topography of Leeds would seem to lend itself to such an arrangement.
One other good thing about Aberdeen - 2 good eating outlets in the terminal (before airside) -- coffees/ snacks/meals/ drinks, etc. LBA seems limited in this area.

 

[ls27]

As I remember the lower car park opposite the terminal building was built that way so a multi story car could be added at a later date