Beijing Capital Airlines

[Dobbo]

Carl - I'm not sure I agree with you in Emirates.

My view is that they act as a tangible proof of underlying demand for a particular route. If an airport, say BHX, can show an airline, say Air China, that so many thousand passengers are travelling from
BHX to Beijing via DXB it provides a pretty compelling case for a direct route...

 

[nwoody2001]

Seems a little harsh (and more-so off topic), especially when some people say we're not being aspirational enough, and other saying we're too small! What your comments fail to appreciate if the fact that our airports are not nationalised interests but are private companies in a commercial world. the size of airport aside, when you look at Birmingham, its surrounding region and wider catchment, the city's airport is disproportionately small. Now as the private organisation that is BHX realises that, why should BHX not compete in a corporate world, and why should the airport be happy expecting their potential customers to go to what are, to all intents and purposes, their competitors???

Would you expect Tesco not go to Manchester because it might already have a Sainsburys? no, they would want to compete, why are airports any different?

You argument also falls flat when regardless of the MEB2 which operate out of Birmingham, we have the likes of Turkish, Pakistan, Air India, Turkmenistan and not now Beijing Capital who appear all willing to compete against the MEB2 from BHX, with the Air India and Turkmenstan using BHX as their only UK entry point outside London, and the later using BHX as their ONLY UK entry point!

 

[Paulsstrange]

Birmingham is the only British City outside London connected by air with SCHEDULED services to the 2 fastest growing and emerging world economies...China and India.

Fact.

PS: The air India dreamliner looks beautiful, such lovely colours as it takes off from brum daily.

 

[Aviador]

Please, gentlemen can we stop this silly debate.

When looking at different airport forums, I chose 'Forums 4 Airports', specifically because of the lack of ugly rhetoric seen elsewhere. This now seems to be rearing it's ugly head here.
Let's get back to informative discussion, regarding aviation, airports and routes.

Kevin

I couldn't agree more. Only a few hours ago I was telling somebody how well behaved we all were on F4A and only a few hours on and the place has descended into chaos!

Here's a snippet from the F4A guidelines.

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Beijing Capital Airlines

Discussion continued.....

 

[User001]

Just to quickly finish up as I'd like to clarify my stance.

Woody

I stick up for BHX because I love aviation in general, so, although my main alligence is MAN, any new services are to be celebrated.

Despite my posts sometimes coming across as anti-BHX, I actually love BHX and its turn around in the past few years, it's Paul Kehoe in isolation that grinds my gears, mainly because of his derogatory comments about MAN, as I believe there is no place or need for them. If the shoe was on the other foot, you are quite passionate about BHX so Im fairly certain you would have the same frustrations.

When both MAN and BHX are growing at phenomenal rates, for the first time in many years I see no need for any Vs arguments or jealousy, we can all sit back, get on with each other and reap the rewards of all the new air services we are currently enjoying.

 

[Ashley]

Why does it always end up with a minority spoiling it for those who enjoy their hobby. It really puts you off posting when you get same rubbish posted over n over again. We all know the facts which airports are bigger or smaller.
Rgds
Ashley

 

[Ray Finkle]

Well that was nearly two pages of garbage that I've had to read through.

To this day I still find it hard to understand the obsession that some people seem to have with Birmingham and why they feel the need for the constant put downs and willy waving?

In case some haven't noticed there is a Manchester forum that is lying near dormant, whenever I log on and look at the 'new posts' lists I only ever see Andy's movements and logs updates? Manchester has a huge amount going on at the moment with loads to look forwards to yet people just seem to want to focus on 'We're bigger than you are'.

Quite frankly it's ridiculous!

I recently started a thread on the Gatwick forum about Tianjin Airlines 2x weekly flights and it got very little response, yet this thread descends into chaos? For those interested in aviation as a whole and not just Birmingham I fail to see how that Gatwick news could not prompt at least some response.

As Kevin pointed out earlier people choose this forum because we don't have the same sort of pathetic tittle tattle that others do, judging by my inbox people are starting to get fed up.

We have the ability to ban people from individual forums, it's something that nobody wants to do but if it needs to happen then it will.

We are a welcoming bunch on the Birmingham forum and are happy for contributions but please leave the attitude at the door

 

[User001]

Your welcome to come and post on the MAN forums too Ray.

You'll be well aware I've tried numerous times to stimulate debate over there, and it's only recently began to pick up a lot more.

You obviously have a passing interest in MAN as there are things that have been posted on this forum that probably started with a look on the MAN threads (such as the route maps)

It's quite disheartening that after many times of trying to get that discussion going, you say that all you see are 'andys movement logs', so, given that 9 topics alone have had posts this week alone, maybe it's time to dip into the threads, take a closer look and say hello?

After all, no point in pointing out 'lack of posts' and not do your bit to help address that issue?

Just a thought, and is no slight on you, just a suggestion?

 

[IanFarquharson]

It was always BHX's plan to 'build up' these Chinese flights both in frequency, destinations and conversion into a schedule service.

Year 1 - China Southern - just 3 charter flights to PEK
Year 2 - Hainan - 17 charter flights to PEK
Year 3 - Beijing Capital - about 14 weeks at 2pw so approx 28 scheduled flights to two destinations
Year 4 - Hopefully a full summer season of scheduled flights to at least the two destinations and possibly Guanghzou too and at an increased frequency maybe 2 pw to all 3 cities.

Great plan and now reaping the rewards.

 

[nwoody2001]

Just to quickly finish up as I'd like to clarify my stance.

Woody

I stick up for BHX because I love aviation in general, so, although my main alligence is MAN, any new services are to be celebrated.

Despite my posts sometimes coming across as anti-BHX, I actually love BHX and its turn around in the past few years, it's Paul Kehoe in isolation that grinds my gears, mainly because of his derogatory comments about MAN, as I believe there is no place or need for them. If the shoe was on the other foot, you are quite passionate about BHX so Im fairly certain you would have the same frustrations.

When both MAN and BHX are growing at phenomenal rates, for the first time in many years I see no need for any Vs arguments or jealousy, we can all sit back, get on with each other and reap the rewards of all the new air services we are currently enjoying.

Please mate, you really don't need to justify yourself. My tongue in cheek response, whilst mentioning you, was targeted more at someone else. Ive said it before and i'll say it again, with the exception of your own views on PK, I really value your input here, and in regard to your above message, I couldn't agree more!!!

 

[nwoody2001]

Back to the news and topic at hand, and a more general view of what BHX has achieved over the last few years...

At the start of 2012, Birmingham only had long-haul scheduled connections to the following countries (excluding package holiday flights)

In 2012:

Canada (YYZ)
Pakistan (ISB)
Turkmenistan (ASB)
UAE (DXB)
USA (EWR)

Only 3 years later, in 2016 BHX now has the following:

Canada (YYZ)
China (PEK/HGH)
India (DEL/ATQ)
Pakistan (ISB)
Qatar (DOH)
Turkmenistan (ASB)
UAE (DXB)
USA (EWR/JFK)

Again, yes other airports larger than us leave us out in the rain, there is no doubting that, but for an airport that in 2012 carried just 8.9 million passengers, to increase it long-haul scheduled network from 5 destinations in 5 countries, up to 11 million passengers and up to 11 destinations in 8 countries is a pretty impressive figure, especially considering most of that has occurred in the last 12-24 months!

BHX is now the only UK airport outside London, and is likely to smallest none-capital city airport in Europe to have scheduled connections to both the largest countries in the world... China and India! not too shabby!

 

[JENNYJET]

Cannot see past J10 of M6......

We often cannot GET PAST junction 10 when someone screws up and closes the road AGAIN!!!

This is why BHX has to get stuck into the routes market and as others have mentioned, get bold, think big and see the passengers flock into Birmingham.

 

[Ray Finkle]

After all, no point in pointing out 'lack of posts' and not do your bit to help address that issue?

Just a thought, and is no slight on you, just a suggestion?

Noted and I shall try and make an effort.

My only concern is that with some of the seeming obsessive hatred for Birmingham, if I post something less than complimentary it could cause yet even more arguments. I seem to remember Thunderchild posting some news, negative news but still news and people immediately jumped down his throat.

What I would say to MAN forumers in general is that MAN is probably the most exciting airport in the country at the moment, loads of new services and huge redevelopment. There is so much to discuss it surely must be better than ridiculous attempts to belittle an airport half it's size? Get posting on the MAN forum.

Nwoody, great post and it shows how far we have come. Five new long haul routes in one year has to be a BHX record?

Still plenty more to do though

 

[Aviador]

Somebody said the routes would only be used by Chinese tourists.

Ar this stage who really cares if the routes are mainly used by Chinese tourists. Whichever way you look at it, it's bringing extra business to the UK and the Midlands in particular. China is a massive untapped market and even if we only tap into a small proportion of that market it will lead to inward investment and the potential for future growth.

 

[Butty]

It was always BHX's plan to 'build up' these Chinese flights both in frequency, destinations and conversion into a schedule service.

Year 1 - China Southern - just 3 charter flights to PEK
Year 2 - Hainan - 17 charter flights to PEK
Year 3 - Beijing Capital - about 14 weeks at 2pw so approx 28 scheduled flights to two destinations
Year 4 - Hopefully a full summer season of scheduled flights to at least the two destinations and possibly Guanghzou too and at an increased frequency maybe 2 pw to all 3 cities.

Great plan and now reaping the rewards.

I agree on the Guangzhou target, Ian. The best thing about the announcement this week is the confirmation that China (for it is but one industry at the end of the day) is now looking to diversify the China and UK regional links beyond HK and Bejing. Promising for BHX and other regions. I would expect a Scotland link will be next on the list with full loads to and from BHX leading to an year round announcement before long albeit on a limited flights per week basis.

 

[Ray Finkle]

Not that I'd expect to see one at Birmingham but it appears that Capital Airlines are getting A340's.

The new routes that they've applied to the CAAC for:

Beijing Capital Airlines Limited for the opening in the following route:

　　1. As from January 2017 opened in Beijing - Mexico City round-trip passenger flights, using the models for the A340, 3 classes per week;

　　Second, since June 2017 opened in Beijing - Zagreb round-trip passenger flights, using the models for the A330, 2 classes per week;

　　Third, since May 2017 opened in Beijing - Helsinki round-trip passenger flights, using the models for the A330, 2 classes per week.

 

[Brum X]

This is a very interesting article and mentions BHX and its new flights to China.
http://www.routesonline.com/news/29/breaking-news/254405/the-chinese-dragon-roars-in-the-uk/

 

[Ray Finkle]

Hmm, the more I think about this the more underwhelmed I am.

I'm also not convinced about them trying to pass Hangzhou off as Shanghai.

It'll be good to see though and will give the airport some great publicity

 

[Brum X]

What do you mean Ray you are becoming underwhelmed ??

This was the news we were waiting for and its our biggest series of flights to China.

Im very surprised to hear you say that.

 

[User001]

I do think trying to pass of Hangzou as Shanghai is very risky. It could potentially be seen as misleading, as, Hangzou is not officiated to Shanghai at all. We all laugh at Ryanair passing off Hahn as Frankfurt, but, at least that airport is officially Frankfurt-Hahn. Hangzou is not Shanghai-Hangzou.

Birmingham should be marketing the airport properly. It's a huge coup to have a route no other UK airport has. Shanghai could potentially be lost in the Heathrow mix of people looking at Shanghai flights from the UK. But, fully marketing as Hangzou will give BHX the edge.

it will be interesting to see where Beijing Capital go from here. will they go year round? Will they bring the A340? Will they increase frequency?

The only think that ponders, is that had Hainan continued, there is clear scope for the other destinations they serve Long haul (Chingching, Xi'an, Changsha) and a clear brand and growth path, whereas, it's less clear to see what the next moves of Beijing capital will be, they have a clear mission statement of being a leisure orientated carrier, so, will they stick to low frequency secondary routes?

This isn't meant to sound like a downer, more of, now th confetti has settled, analysing what the news actually means.