Primera Air

[Ray Finkle]

New York and Toronto now bookable through until Dec.

 

[rollo]

New York and Toronto now bookable through until Dec.

Alleylueya, hopefully this means a year round service - good news.

 

[paul]

Hi Ray sure I've just seen Tenerife on there site added also

 

[Ray Finkle]

Hi Ray sure I've just seen Tenerife on there site added also

Sure is and Gran Canaria, both weekly.

 

[jfy1999]

While this is very good news, the Brexit negotiations with the US over TATL are causing me some concern at the moment.

From what I gather it seems the US are (so far) only willing to admit airlines which have a majority of UK ownership. So at the moment both Primera and Norwegian look under threat and the setting up of UK subsidiaries doesn't look like it will help.

 

[Jerry]

While this is very good news, the Brexit negotiations with the US over TATL are causing me some concern at the moment.

From what I gather it seems the US are (so far) only willing to admit airlines which have a majority of UK ownership. So at the moment both Primera and Norwegian look under threat and the setting up of UK subsidiaries doesn't look like it will help.

So are British Airways, Virgin Atlantic, Thomas Cook and TUI as they are either EU owned or non majority UK owned.

 

[Ray Finkle]

Gran Canaria is on a Friday and Tenerife on a Saturday.

Flight timings are pretty decent.

Gran Canaria

PF2971/2

BHX 08:00 LPA 12:15
LPA 13:15 BHX 17:25

Tenerife

PF2975/6

BHX 08:00 TFS 12:20
TFS 13:20 BHX 17:35

Malaga is bookable after Dec 9th on Tue, Thur and Sun, nothing for Barcelona yet.

 

[Brum X]

Sure is and Gran Canaria, both weekly.

Woohoo, LPA is a hotspot for me so hopefully will use Primera in the future now that Norweigan have gone.

Great news about EWR/YYZ being bookable. Great to have Toronto available direct from BHX in the winter months, this is a big improvement compared to what Air Transat offered.

Good stuff Primera Air

 

[nwoody2001]

Has anyone else notice Manchester has also appeared ...Malaga bookable!

 

[GliderPilot]

Has anyone else notice Manchester has also appeared ...Malaga bookable!

It was only a matter of time...

Guessing it'll be a BHX aircraft doing a BHX-AGP-MAN-AGP-BHX or something like that

MAG after the STN launch have gone, 'Oh we have a nice airport further north too'

 

[Ray Finkle]

Guessing it'll be a BHX aircraft doing a BHX-AGP-MAN-AGP-BHX or something like that

It looks like a Malaga based aircraft doing CDG every morning then a mixture of BHX and MAN in the afternoon.

 

[Jon Dempsey]

Good luck to Primera. An entrepreneurial business looking to make a profit.

 

[IanFarquharson]

Good news about NY & Toronto
I think we knew Manchester was coming next !

 

[Ray Finkle]

From what I can make out, as of Dec 10th the BHX based aircraft doing daily BCN and AGP moves to Malaga and then operates 6x weekly CDG in the morning and 4x weekly MAN/3x weekly BHX in the afternoon.

We then get an aircraft position in from KEF on a Thur, operating ALC, LPA (Fri), TFS (Sat) and ALC again before returning to KEF on the Sun.

Where Barcelona fits in I do not know, another away based destination?

So despite the glossy headlines of new routes we may have actually lost a based aircraft and dropped from 14 weekly short haul to 8 weekly (no BCN yet so it may rise). In contrast STN remains a base with 3x weekly AGP and TFS and LPA at 2x weekly each.

More twists and turns than a cheap garden hose and I think there could well be more to come.

It will be interesting to see if the away based system continues into S19 with BHX becoming a short haul 'destination' rather than a 'base'?

 

[nwoody2001]

this is where we are at so far...


September (21x Weekly)

1. AGP (7x Weekly)
   
2. EWR (4x Weekly)
   
3. PMI (7x Weekly) – Bookable until 30th Sept
   
4. YYZ (3x Weekly)

October (21x Weekly)

1. AGP (7x Weekly)
   
2. BCN (7x Weekly) – Starts 1st Oct
   
3. EWR (4x Weekly)
   
4. YYZ (3x Weekly)

November (21x Weekly)

1. AGP (7x Weekly)
   
2. BCN (7x Weekly)
   
3. EWR (4x Weekly)
   
4. YYZ (3x Weekly)

December (21x Weekly)

1. AGP (3x Weekly) – Reduced from 7x Weekly to 3x Weekly 10th Dec
   
2. ALC (2x Weekly) – Starts 6th Dec
   
3. BCN (7x Weekly) – Bookable until 9th Dec
   
4. EWR (4x Weekly) – Bookable until 9th Dec
   
5. LPA (1x Weekly) – Starts 7th Dec
   
6. TFS (1x Weekly) – Starts 8th Dec
   
7. YYZ (3x Weekly) – Bookable until 8th Dec

January (8x Weekly)

1. AGP (3x Weekly)
   
2. ALC (2x Weekly)
   
3. BCN (???)
   
4. EWR (???)
   
5. KEF (1x Weekly) – Starts 13th Jan
   
6. LPA (1x Weekly)
   
7. TFS (1x Weekly)
   
8. YYZ (???)

February (8x Weekly)

1. AGP (3x Weekly)
   
2. ALC (2x Weekly)
   
3. BCN (???)
   
4. EWR (???)
   
5. KEF (1x Weekly)
   
6. LPA (1x Weekly)
   
7. TFS (1x Weekly)
   
8. YYZ (???)

March (8x Weekly)

1. AGP (3x Weekly)
   
2. ALC (2x Weekly)
   
3. BCN (???)
   
4. EWR (???)
   
5. KEF (1x Weekly)
   
6. LPA (1x Weekly)
   
7. TFS (1x Weekly)
   
8. YYZ (???)
   

 

[Brum X]

From what I can make out, as of Dec 10th the BHX based aircraft doing daily BCN and AGP moves to Malaga and then operates 6x weekly CDG in the morning and 4x weekly MAN/3x weekly BHX in the afternoon.

We then get an aircraft position in from KEF on a Thur, operating ALC, LPA (Fri), TFS (Sat) and ALC again before returning to KEF on the Sun.

Where Barcelona fits in I do not know, another away based destination?

So despite the glossy headlines of new routes we may have actually lost a based aircraft and dropped from 14 weekly short haul to 8 weekly (no BCN yet so it may rise). In contrast STN remains a base with 3x weekly AGP and TFS and LPA at 2x weekly each.

More twists and turns than a cheap garden hose and I think there could well be more to come.

It will be interesting to see if the away based system continues into S19 with BHX becoming a short haul 'destination' rather than a 'base'?

But this is winter so maybe to be expected, especially at an airport like BHX.

However if our TATL continue all winter then we are still a base for Primera Air.

This is showing continued commitment even through the quieter months and i think we need to stop comparing the STN base with the BHX base.

So for these reasons i am happy with the direction they are going, only time will tell what the future holds but they have some popular sun routes, so hopefully will do well.

Im really chuffed that it appears EWR/YYZ will be year round. This was the whole point of Primera Air from the start, these Euro routes are a nice bonus.

 

[nwoody2001]

Certainly a very changeable situation but some interesting developments.

- Long-Haul extended into Dec which offer comfort that routes are to be year-round and not seasonal. A great coup for YYZ!!!
- The schedule is starting to look more conventional to what you would expect of an airline. Until today, Primera only seemed interested in daily operations which is a tall ask for most destinations from a standing start. Now however, aircraft are being used to serve more destinations. ALC, KEF, LPA and TFS have all been added in the last few days.
- Whilst I will not question Rays findings (I've not looked at the timetable and am far from an expert) but what is interesting is that on the first full week of December, all routes operate simultaneously...

So what is next to come?

In answer, no idea and anyone's guess. I would be shocked in BCN goes as it was only launched in October so to disappear only 2.5 months after starting would be unusual, so will it be retained, and if so, how many per week? Can we also presume that EWR and YYZ will also last through the winter now?

Eitherway, all should become clear in the next few weeks as Primera have stated a fill winter schedule will be announced by the end of March. Hopefully the 21x weekly flights being operated at the start of the winter season will carry on through to the rest of the winter season

 

[nwoody2001]

To demonstrate what Ray how suggested, I have looked at the Europe routes timetable for a random week in Mid January which is as follows:

Monday 14th Jan
(No Flights)

Tuesday 15th Jan
14:30 AGP – 16:15 BHX (PF2934) 738 A/C1
17:15 BHX – 21:05 AGP (PF2933) 738 A/C1

Wednesday 16th Jan
(No Flights)

Thursday 17th Jan
08:30 KEF – 11:05 BHX (PF0195) 738 A/C2
12:35 BHX – 16:10 ALC (PF2935) 738 A/C2
14:30 AGP – 16:15 BHX (PF2934) 738 A/C1
17:10 ALC – 18:50 BHX (PF2936) 738 A/C2
17:15 BHX – 21:05 AGP (PF2933) 738 A/C1

Friday 18th Jan
08:00 BHX – 12:15 LPA (PF2971) 738 A/C2
13:15 LPA – 17:25 BHX (PF2972) 738 A/C2

Saturday 19th Jan
08:00 BHX – 12:20 TFS (PF2975) 738 A/C2
13:20 TFS – 17:35 BHX (PF2976) 738 A/C2

Sunday 20th Jan
11:15 BHX – 14:50 ALC (PF2935) 738 A/C2
14:30 AGP – 16:15 BHX (PF2934) 738 A/C1
15:50 ALC – 17:30 BHX (PF2936) 738 A/C2
17:15 BHX – 21:05 AGP (PF2933) 738 A/C1
19:00 BHX – 21:45 KEF (PF0196) 738 A/C2

Obviously I must stress this does not include the TATL flights, which assuming they continue would equate to 15x weekly flights or 30x sectors which would equate to just under 5,800 seats per week. Based on what has currently been released, Ray is indeed correct, with our based unit moving to AGP to serve BHX,MAN and CDG with another aircraft coming in from KEF to become based at BHX for 4 days of the week. This currently leaves no European flights on Monday and Wednesdays.

That said, things can still change, have we lost a based unit to AGP or has our based unit not yet been included in the schedule? After all, why move and base a unit at APG (in their low season) when a relocate a unit from KEF to BHX during their high season? Also, what happens to BCN which will only have been operating at daily but only for 2 months and 1 week? if that lost in a space less than a season?

No doubt it is just a case of watch this space.

 

[Kevin Farnell]

I'm pleased to read that EWR and YYZ are now showing until Dec 9th and 8th respectively. This matches what is showing from STN, so gives me some hope that the BHX TATL services will continue.
One thing that really bugs me about the Primera website, is that whenever I look at it I'm greeted with 'Direct Flights from London' and the STN destinations shown below. It requires me to click on a small arrow next to the 'London' title, in order for me to find the 'Birmingham' destiantions. Why not promote both departure points on the homepage? I also wonder if this has had a detrimental affect on BHX bookings.
I'd very much like to see BHX-EWR return to a daily service, but realise that this would mean either losing YYZ or a second aircraft based and a new destination served.

Kevin

 

[Jon Dempsey]

To demonstrate what Ray how suggested, I have looked at the Europe routes timetable for a random week in Mid January which is as follows:






After all, why move and base a unit at APG (in their low season) when a relocate a unit from KEF to BHX during their high season? Also, what happens to BCN which will only have been operating at daily but only for 2 months and 1 week? if that lost in a space less than a season?

No doubt it is just a case of watch this space.

Primera have been flying into Malaga from their Scandinavian bases for some years now.
It seems to me that they are just trying to “sweat their metal” a bit more.