Leeds Bradford - General Thread

[Tarn Spotter]

Whilst there is need to maintain growth, dropping routes does not have to be an issue. The number of flights in the year to July from LBA are down by 3.8%, but passengers up by 6%. Getting rid of poor performing routes is surely the right way forward.
How many slots are now available in the period 7am to 9am slot, this is surely going to be the achilles heel for future expansion, if we want more carriers like B A to park overnight, are the resources in place, i.e. parking, gates, comments on this site would say no.
Good luck to the people doing the master plan, cant think of a more thankless task, Ryan air just produced the most gloomy prediction for this winters operation standing even more aircraft down, obviously this could be M O L wanting to produce good figures in the future, but is he is right on the reduced loads for this winter, makes grim reading for the likes of Bridgeport.

 

[White Heather]

Nothing at all was said with regard to where the additional passengers would come from, but there again, I would not expect anything, because Bridgepoint never, ever, give anything away that is regarded as Commercial in Confidence. They did say they had been over to Dublin for a meeting with O'Leary and they did say that in 18 months time Ryanair would be getting another major influx of aircraft. They also said that it remained to be seen whether that led to any expansion at LBA.

I would imagine that if Jet2 have dropped Olbia (which if I not mistaken is a split load anyway with EDI) and La Rochelle, they will use the aircraft to destinations which will attract more pax. Likewise, TOM are dropping Sharm (understandable given the things going on out there) but are introducing a 2nd flight to Corfu, which hopefully will have better passengers loads.

I am sure that there will be something going on that we are not yet being told about, but I cannot give you any clues as no clues have been given to us at the meeting.

 

[Bigman]

How close are we to finalising the winter 2013/4 timetable? Can only be 5 weeks before it starts.

 

[lbaspotter]

How close are we to finalising the winter 2013/4 timetable? Can only be 5 weeks before it starts.

It's currently a works in progress with 90% completed. Should have the final 10% done tonight and ready for publishing onto the website.

 

[Bigman]

Thanks lbaspotter. Looking forward to it. Presumably it will have the one-off 4 day Transun trip to Kerry in March showing?

 

[lbaspotter]

Thanks lbaspotter. Looking forward to it. Presumably it will have the one-off 4 day Transun trip to Kerry in March showing?

I boodly wish! Can't find it available anywhere. It's not even on sale on Transun's own website. I've even gone as far as checking Kerry Airport website to see if it was listed on there but it not. Lol

On another note I did find out that Polish based airline, Enter Air will be back with there Boeing 737-400's again operating the Xmas and artic Lapland trips this winter season for Transun.

 

[lbaspotter]

How close are we to finalising the winter 2013/4 timetable? Can only be 5 weeks before it starts.

Good news all, I've just completed and uploaded to my website my own produced provisional LBA Winter 2013/14 timetable. Just to note that the usual disclaimer applies.

To view and download you own free copy please use the following link. http://www.lbaspotters.net/winter201314timetable.htm

 

[Bigman]

Thanks lbaspotter. Great job as usual.

 

[pdbaxt]

Thanks lbaspotter. I note the LS223 to TFS on Saturdays in Nov & some of Dec is due to be operated by a 738. The booking engine on Jet2.com is still showing a 752. I've a personal interest in this one as I'll be on it on 14/12 and have not been on a Jet2 738 yet!

 

[Tarn Spotter]

Seemed another breakdown in communication at the airport on Monday. Arrived on Ls198 from Ibiza 5 minutes early. Parked in the sticks and loaded on the new bendy buses almost at once.
However, on getting to the arrivals enterence, we were held for 35 minutes on the bus whilst the KLM at the door was loaded. Loading had not started on the KLM and it was good 5/10 minutes before passengers started to embark. Surely not beyond the ability to multi task both operations or take the bus to the walkway and unload us there. By the time we got off then bus had to queue for customs as the other planes had used the walkway.
No ground operation staff seemed to be bothered about the discomfort of the old people like me aboard the buses, strangly although the plane full would say 80% of passengers over 55's not youngsters, all in line with last years holiday number on the island that stated only 17% of visitors clubbers, pity newspaper and tv give the wrong impression of the island.

 

[lbaspotter]

Leeds Bradford International Airport has just posted the following interesting tweet on there twitter account late this evening.

LeedsBradfordAirport @LBIAirport
Thank you to all our travel trade partners/agents for voting us @TravelBulletin Star Regional UK Airport!!

It was in reply to the following tweet

Travel Bulletin @TravelBulletin
Star Regional UK Airport Leeds Bradford International Airport

By looks of things it looks as they may have won the award for "Star Regional UK Airport" in the Travel Bulletin 2013 Star Awards. According to there website http://www.travelbulletin.co.uk/awards/ ... lists-2013 Leeds/Bradford was up against Bournemouth, Bristol, East Midlands, London Luton and Southampton Airports

 

[Aviador]

Great, but there are so many of these kind of awards these days. Doncaster won one too last month, so I tend to take them all with a pinch of salt.

 

[lbaspotter]

Great, but there are so many of these kind of awards these days. Doncaster won one too last month, so I tend to take them all with a pinch of salt.

Yeah agree that the award DSA won last year and came 2nd in this year was daft. As we all know it was only voted due to it been so dam quite there, so allows for a good terminal experience.
At least in this award won by LBA it was up against other airports in its size category.

Anyway why not let's be positive for once seen as the airport has won something for once....

 

[752]

hmm, interesting read http://www.examiner.co.uk/news/west-yor ... rd-6176981

 

[lbaspotter]

hmm, interesting read http://www.examiner.co.uk/news/west-yor ... rd-6176981

The closure off RAF Church Fenton at the end of the year comes to mind yet again! It has good road access been next to M1 & A1(M) and near to the M62. It also sits next to Leeds-York rail line with a train station nearby as well.

 

[Bigman]

I am with lbaspotter on this. I think it’s fair to say that we all know that LBIA has serious shortcomings, whether it be the location on a hill, wind sheer, runway the wrong direction, no CATII on 14, runway length, no rail linking, poor road access or all the other arguments that keep coming up.

Now is surely the time for us to look at the wider picture of our region as a whole.

LBIA is clearly not ideal and is off many airline and passenger radars. DSA quite frankly has failed to deliver on all the intitial hype. HUY has not expanded and DTV is quite frankly a joke.

For me, the best options has got to be a brand new ‘super airport’ for our region, that can serve the whole region with long haul flights and be easily accessible.

Church Fenton for me fits the bill. If as reported it is to close, then now is the time to get in there and develop the site as an international airport. We could have a new 10,000ft runway with CATIIIB ILS in both directions. The site lies only ½ mile from the existing Church Fenton station which has 4 platforms, and just look at the vast array of trains that operate through the station, ie:

Transpennine service from Liverpool, Manchester Airport, Manchester, Huddersfield, Dewsbury and Leeds to York, Scarborough, Middlesbrough and Newcastle.

Northern Train services from Manchester, Blackpool, Preston, Blackburn, Burnley, Todmorden, Hebden Bridge, Halifax, Bradford and Leeds to York and Scarborough

Northern Trains services from York to Selby and Hull and York to Pontefract, Rotherham and Sheffield (albeit infrequent)

Cross Country Trains services from Penzance, Plymouth, Exeter, Bristol, Birmingham, Derby, Sheffield, Wakefield and Leeds, to York, Darlington, Durham, Newcastle, Edinburgh, Dundee, Aberdeen, Motherwell and Glasgow

So by my reckoning, that’s every major town and city in Yorkshire bar Barnsley, Doncaster and Harrogate that already has trains running through Church Fenton. I am quite sure that timetables could be amended to ensure that all these places are served.

You could make things even better by building a second new station to the East of the airport on the ECML, giving direct services to Doncaster and London.

Added to all this is the close proximity of the A1, and I think that says it all.

The existing LBA, DSA and DTV sites can then be sold off for real estate which would part fund the new airport, which would have all the Yorkshire councils as stakeholders.

We might then finally have an airport that can properly compete with Manchester.

Right then, tin hat on!!

 

[a300boy]

I cannot disagree with the sentiment but this opportunity was missed a long time ago.
I live next to Lbia by choice and would fight tooth and to keep this airport on my doorstep and not have it replaced by a new housing estate.
Church Fentons longest runway is just over 6000ft long at present so this is a massive restriction to start with. The cost of moving and building the new infrastructure would be massive and who would pay for it ? Why not spend a lot less and resolve some of the issues we have here. The Vale of York suffers a lot from fog so we might find not all the weather problems we have are resolved.

 

[lbaspotter]

I cannot disagree with the sentiment but this opportunity was missed a long time ago.
I live next to Lbia by choice and would fight tooth and to keep this airport on my doorstep and not have it replaced by a new housing estate.
Church Fentons longest runway is just over 6000ft long at present so this is a massive restriction to start with. The cost of moving and building the new infrastructure would be massive and who would pay for it ? Why not spend a lot less and resolve some of the issues we have here. The Vale of York suffers a lot from fog so we might find not all the weather problems we have are resolved.

Well I wasn't expecting that reply from you A300boy. Not having a go at you, but you've have been one of the many to slate LBA at every opportunity on here just recently regarding weather and winter operations. Even though I know you support LBA and have done so for a very long time!

Yes the Vale of York suffers from Fog, So dose everywhere else for that matter. But Church Fenton with a extended 10,000ft runway would have CAT111B on both ends without any runway restrictions in place like current situation at LBA.

I would also just like to add that I want the airport to stay where it is now. I think we all agree that LBA is just crying out for some major improvements to be made to it's Infrastructure and also get rid of some of the current operational restrictions that are in place so to make it the airport it should be, Which is not the one that it currently is!

 

[airforced]

No tin hat required as far as I am concerned Bigman. IF Church Fenton is closing then what you suggest would be a very good idea indeed. HOWEVER I can immediatelt think of 3 good reasons why it wouldn't happen.

1. Vested interests
2. Vested interests and
3. Vested interests

Oh and I've just thought of another good reason. Money (or the lack of it to more precise). Unless Boy George returns from China with a blank cheque from the Chinese Govt I can't think of anyone who would be prepared to fork out for such a scheme particularly after the recent huge pot of money squandered at Finningley which, as A300boy mentions, is afflicted with the same fog that Ch Fenton would have.

No, I'm afraid the whole idea is very Pie in the Sky and wouldn't even get as far as the drawing board. It should however make for some interesting discussions on here and elsewhere though.

 

[Aviador]

The 405 metre runway extension at Birmingham (BHX) is costing around £33 million so an extra 1200 metres of runway at Church Fenton would cost in the region of £100 million. You're probably looking at a further £200 million for taxiways, access roads, terminals and aprons etc. Bear in mind when Manchester Airport built terminal 2 it cost £200 million. That's around £300 million to bring the Church Fenton airport up to scratch if we want a proper international airport?

A further problem with moving LEEDS BRADFORD airport is it will be just as easy to get to Manchester airport for people living in Bradford and much of West Yorkshire. A Leeds airport, that's nearer to York than to Leeds would suffer the same way as DONCASTER Sheffield has with a limited prospect of attracting scheduled business type flights.

How much would it cost to sort out LBA? It's a good question and I wonder if either Bridgepoint or Leeds City Council ever accosted it? I'd probably say around £40 million to extend the runway, move the lighting and instrument landing aids? New terminal and apron £100 million maybe? New parallel taxiway £50 million? It's difficult to quantify just exactly how much it would cost to sort out all the problems that exist at LBA but most people would agree it would be considerably cheaper than effectively building a new airport virtually from scratch at Church Fenton.

I can fully appreciate why so many people vent their frustrations when it comes to LBA. The airport was sold by the council prior to the global financial meltdown. Leeds City Council promised the airport would be sold to a company who would seek to massively upgrade the airport. Other airports around the UK are spending a substantial amount of money to expand and improve facilities. For whatever reason we see very little in the way of improvements from our own airport. The airport may have spent more perhaps substantially more but the flying public have only seen £15 million pounds spent over 5 years. To put that into prospective, the cost of build of the new Leeds Trinity Shopping centre was around £100 million.

Ultimately LBA is owned outright by Bridgepoint and it is their airport and they can do what they choose with it. As onlookers who want to see an expanding Leeds Bradford airport we can do nothing other than soundbite when we think it could be done better. People DO vote with their feet when it comes to flying. If another private company chooses to spend the money on Church Fenton, only then will we know how successful it would be.