Route Development & Rumours

[lbaspotter]

Fingers crossed for the rumoured EZY announcement. Are we talking a possible base or just additional routes using non based a/c?

Definitely not based aircraft. Have heard a few med sun/beach routes are possible.

 

[KARFA]

My preference would be BA to LHR as wandering off a domestic gate into departures in T5 is such a breeze compared with the likes of AMS - LM would be a great start on a code share but the limitations of a transit from T2 do water down the slickness of connections - having said that BA have a sizeable operation at T3 also so maybe I'm just being picky! Does anyone know if BA offer avois seats on codeshares with LM?

No avios seats offered on LM when booking thro BA.

LM did operate for a short period from T5 during covid, but i guess as all LM is now in T2, any new routes go there.

The set up in T2 is the same as T5, so domestic arrival connecting to any T2 flight would just be a simple bp check and in to departures. Unfortunately the way airside connections are set up in LHR, as soon as you swap terminals you will mix with international arrivals so need to go thro security once you get to your onward terminal. Very annoying if you are arriving from a domestic in to T5 and connecting on to T3, and would be the same here if arriving in T2 and connecting from T3 or T5. Tbh with a domestic arrival in to T5 or T2, and connecting to another terminal, you are better off exiting landside and getting the tube or HEX/crossrail to your next terminal.

 

[Finger66]

An interesting post in the Cardiff/Play thread which if true almost certainly puts to bed any hope we had of seeing them at LBA

 

[LBAYORKIE]

An interesting post in the Cardiff/Play thread which if true almost certainly puts to bed any hope we had of seeing them at LBA

Couldnt find it in the Cardiff thread.

 

[Finger66]

It's actually under the Play thread but linked to Cardiff. Apologies for any confusion

 

[mdobuk21]

Saw this on Plays instagram. I actually commented what about Leeds?!

 

[752]

Play seem to be changing their business model from connecting traffic through KEF to a leisure airline. Shame

 

[pug]

Play seem to be changing their business model from connecting traffic through KEF to a leisure airline. Shame

They are, but it’s a bit of a tough nut to crack that one. Also the decline in U.K.-US travel overall means it’s probably not the right time to try to serve a market that is shrinking.

Even BHX has lost all its North American scheduled links, apart from TUI I believe every other route over the Atlantic has gone?

 

[Iron Duck]

Hopefully the A321XLR will change the playing field transatlantic wise. For too long, airlines have been happy to send an A330 to MAN and call it a day. You’d think the likes of JetBlue and United would be interested in operating to new markets where they can have a monopoly, not the usual LHR/EDI/MAN crap.

 

[pug]

Hopefully the A321XLR will change the playing field transatlantic wise. For too long, airlines have been happy to send an A330 to MAN and call it a day. You’d think the likes of JetBlue and United would be interested in operating to new markets where they can have a monopoly, not the usual LHR/EDI/MAN crap.

Doesn’t work like that. It’s an expensive game and just because the aircraft might be smaller, doesn’t mean the costs would be!

They don’t just send an A330 and call it a day, they carefully choose where they will operate from to reduce costs as much as possible and avoid splitting loads and diluting revenue to the point of non-viability and they do this by flying from fewer airports with the right infrastructure and catchment areas.

History has shown that a foray into the regions is not sustainable.. BRS and NCL have both had US scheduled services and since lost them, BHX no longer has any. What LBA needs is resilient growth, a short lived scheduled flight to the states would do no good for the airports reputation.

 

[gulftraveller]

Hopefully the A321XLR will change the playing field transatlantic wise. For too long, airlines have been happy to send an A330 to MAN and call it a day. You’d think the likes of JetBlue and United would be interested in operating to new markets where they can have a monopoly, not the usual LHR/EDI/MAN crap.

There is a major technical problem. The A321XLR with a full load needs 8000ft plus of runway (at sea level). A321XLR has great range, but it is not like a 757 in being able to operate from shorter runways. This aircraft, like the 7M8, is not the answer to providing services from regional airports to US or Dubai, for example.

Also keep in mind that the more destinations, the higher the overheads. So for a legacy carrier, operating into LPL, MAN and LBA is not a good business proposal.

 

[Aviador]

The A321XLR with a full load needs 8000ft plus of runway (at sea level).

And there lies the caviat. The definition of a full load must mean it is full of fuel and passengers to a maximum take off weight and there is the answer to destinations achievable from LBA.
So fully laden from an 8000 ft runway will allow 4,700 nautical miles of flying time. So from an unrestricted runway it has the following range.
The question is how far can it go with restricted fuel weight from a 7000 ft runway?



Along with an optional additional centre tank, it extends the A321XLR's maximum range to 4,700 nautical miles or 11 hours of flying time.19 Sept 2023
View attachment 31476
https://www.airbus.com › stories

What makes the A321XLR so attractive to airlines? - Airbus​

 

[White Heather]

And there lies the caviat. The definition of a full load must mean it is full of fuel and passengers to a maximum take off weight and there is the answer to destinations achievable from LBA.
So fully laden from an 8000 ft runway will allow 4,700 nautical miles of flying time. So from an unrestricted runway it has the following range.
The question is how far can it go with restricted fuel weight from a 7000 ft runway?

View attachment 31477

Along with an optional additional centre tank, it extends the A321XLR's maximum range to 4,700 nautical miles or 11 hours of flying time.19 Sept 2023
View attachment 31476
https://www.airbus.com › stories

What makes the A321XLR so attractive to airlines? - Airbus​

When LBA management stated they were talking to US carriers about a route into LBA, (naming one major airline in particular) they stated that the A321XLR. was (to pinch Ryanair's talk,) a Game Changer for LBA. They seemed to have no doubts that New York was do-able from LBA and they seemed pretty confident . I'm not, as I've heard it all before, but they indicated there was genuine interest.

 

[Len Fish]

LBA to New York is 2916 nautical miles, LBA to Dubai 3041nm, so given the maximum range of the 321XLR fully loaded is 4700nm I can see why LBA management are optimistic the aircraft will be a game changer for the airport.

 

[Vzg94w]

LBA to New York is 2916 nautical miles, LBA to Dubai 3041nm, so given the maximum range of the 321XLR fully loaded is 4700nm I can see why LBA management are optimistic the aircraft will be a game changer for the airport.

The problem is you will never get a full laden aircraft out of LBA with enough fuel to fly 4700 miles. You will have to compromise on pax numbers = reduced profit

 

[Aviador]

The problem is you will never get a full laden aircraft out of LBA with enough fuel to fly 4700 miles. You will have to compromise on pax numbers = reduced profit

If you read my earlier post you would understand that you don't have to compromise passenger loads, just fuel but even then the range of this aircraft should be pretty good from LBA.

 

[pug]

Worth pointing out here that whilst the XLR is entirely able to operate those distances from LBA, one of the challenges at the moment will be the fact that a lot of the long-haul airlines also rely on the regular carriage of belly freight to enable maximum revenue. This is not likely to factor too much on an A321XLR type operation.

It is however encouraging to know that LBA are actively engaging with airlines so hopefully something might come of it, but it has to be long lasting and sustainable and history so far has proven this isn’t the case for other airports that are the same size or larger than LBA.

 

[Finger66]

I think the current weakness of the UK-US market will be the game changer, and unfortunately not in a positive way - at least for now.

Separately I had heard recently that Loganair has signed a contract with LBA but nothing more. Anyone know more on this?

And I think it was @lbaspotter mentioned recently that an easyJet announcement was imminent, but don't think LBA had featured in anything thus far, so again anyone any the wiser as to whether we are going to see more from them in 2025?

 

[lbaspotter]

And I think it was @lbaspotter mentioned recently that an easyJet announcement was imminent, but don't think LBA had featured in anything thus far, so again anyone any the wiser as to whether we are going to see more from them in 2025?

Heard on the grapevine that the easyJet announcement has been delayed until next month due some updates to the airlines website & app plus easyJet holidays are involved.

 

[752]

Heard on the grapevine that the easyJet announcement has been delayed until next month due some updates to the airlines website & app plus easyJet holidays are involved.

What are we talking here? a base or more routes or?